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Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

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Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#41

Post by bee_rider »

goalieca wrote: post #5

I gas up a 40L tank once a month in climate where -15 happens for about two or three months. The tires are modest as the car doesn’t weigh much. The winter tires last a while and I just switched to my second pair of summers. Maintenance on a gas powered sedan is pretty minimal as my Honda is extremely reliable. I plan to run the car into the ground until the salt eats it alive. There’s a lot of sedans like mine in my…

I wonder why somebody downvoted you.

Off the cuff, running a car to the end and then switching to a hybrid seems fairly environmentally friendly, right?

I don’t think we want to prematurely take reasonably recent small cars (since you say your car is light, I assume it is small) off the road if that means building a bunch of new electric ones… especially for someone who drives little enough to gas up once per month.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#42

Post by bdcravens »

jwr wrote: post #20
mglz wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

*Thank you* So much hearsay from people who never really used an EV. Yes, there are drawbacks. But except for extreme long range trips EVs are perfectly usable while being more energy efficient and less prone to breaking down.

> except for extreme long range trips I'm writing this comment having just driven about 2000km-long trip with an EV :-) In cold climate (-5C). It's not my first long trip, either. My key observations (some were surprising to me): 1. You should expect to travel slower, as you will need to make breaks for charging, and the EV world presents an overly-rosy view of ranges. In a long trip, you use the battery from 10% to…

I drove from Houston to San Diego and back in my EV6. It wasn't bad, but in the interests of disclosure, I'll point out some of the caveats (some of which may not apply for those using the Tesla network)

1. Our trip was on major interstates (I10 and I8)

2. Not every charging station had full speed

3. Charging stations weren't so close that I could reliably skip one

4. Range goes way down on open freeways (wind resistance, lack of regen)

5. Charging stations aren't always on the freeway like gas stations, so you may find yourself going into towns and off of the freeway, increasing drive time

6. Charge times weren't bad, but I have one of the fastest charging cars, so literally, YMMV

Overall, in a gas car it would have been a 2 day trip; in my EV, it was more like 2 2/3 days (adjusted our intinerary in SD, else we would have had additional hotel costs). That said, I drove just to prove haters wrong; I'd fly the next time. However, if I had to do a long trip, I'd probably consider renting something else.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#43

Post by thefz »

No, I still won't buy an EV. EVs are being forced down or throat to, again, have customers make another buy in the name of the earth. Tax the fuck out of China, India, USA for being the biggest polluters, then tax the fuck out of carbon emissions for the largest emitters. Then you tax the fuck out of SUVs and useless large vehicles. Only then you can go after the combustion engine, which is at its peak efficiency and lowest pollution.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#46

Post by seanmcdirmid »

thefz wrote: post #43

No, I still won't buy an EV. EVs are being forced down or throat to, again, have customers make another buy in the name of the earth. Tax the fuck out of China, India, USA for being the biggest polluters, then tax the fuck out of carbon emissions for the largest emitters. Then you tax the fuck out of SUVs and useless large vehicles. Only then you can go after the combustion engine, which is at its peak efficiency and…

How do you impose taxes on other countries without taking them over first? Sounds like more trouble than it’s worth. It’s like getting Mexico to pay for a wall the USA is building.

China and India have way over a billion people each and still pollute less than the USA on a per capita basis. If you want them to take responsibility for moral reasons, your moral high ground isn’t very high.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#47

Post by seanmcdirmid »

goalieca wrote: post #5

I gas up a 40L tank once a month in climate where -15 happens for about two or three months. The tires are modest as the car doesn’t weigh much. The winter tires last a while and I just switched to my second pair of summers. Maintenance on a gas powered sedan is pretty minimal as my Honda is extremely reliable. I plan to run the car into the ground until the salt eats it alive. There’s a lot of sedans like mine in my…

Electric cars are really popular in Norway, and it’s not a warm tropical country in the winter.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#48

Post by supertrope »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #47
goalieca wrote: post #5

I gas up a 40L tank once a month in climate where -15 happens for about two or three months. The tires are modest as the car doesn’t weigh much. The winter tires last a while and I just switched to my second pair of summers. Maintenance on a gas powered sedan is pretty minimal as my Honda is extremely reliable. I plan to run the car into the ground until the salt eats it alive. There’s a lot of sedans like mine in my…

Electric cars are really popular in Norway, and it’s not a warm tropical country in the winter.

EVs are exempt from a 100% tax on conventional cars.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#49

Post by logifail »

supertrope wrote: post #38
ttymck wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In my case rough estimates are a stop every 2h or 250km... It's not a big deal. Especially if you can find a place to charge where you will also eat or drink. As a huge proponent of EVs, I have to imagine a major chunk of the population would disagree with you. Most people (in the US, at least) aren't leisurely taking road trips. They are in a hurry, trying not to eat up all 3 weeks of PTO with the annual family ro…

While extra time for EV charging is annoying, when using a gasoline car you still have to stop every two hours to pee, stretch your legs, and swap drivers. Sitting in an enclosed space for hours on end increases the risk of blood clots. So the actual increase in stopped time is e.g. 30 min to L3 charge to 80% minus the 15 min for a restroom/gasoline/coffee break multiplied by number of stops. So an hour lost per day.

> when using a gasoline car you still have to stop every two hours to pee, stretch your legs, and swap drivers

Source?

My longest ICE-powered trip recently was a ~500 mile trip across Europe with precisely one 15 minute break to pee and buy coffee. A total of ~8 hours on the road, and I was driving alone. On the plus side it was a very nice rented Audi.

Re: Gasoline is cheap – but charging an EV is still cheaper

#50

Post by bbatha »

mc32 wrote: post #29
jwr wrote: post #14

So much wrong information in the comments here (or, rather, lack of information, because most comments are ill-informed). See for example https://www.carbonbrief.org/factcheck-how-electric-vehicles-... for a good debunking of many common myths (good showing here). Yes, one should not accept the all-rosy picture of EVs being all-clean and ideal. But my EV a) is 4-5 times more efficient overall in converting energy int…

One thing EVs need to address is the cost of repairs. Yes an ICE engine needs regular maintenance, but currently that cost savings in an EV is offset by the larger repair costs as well as wait times for repairs (due to parts availability, like dearth of OEM parts, like you can’t go down to NAPA and get parts.

That like OPs post is also a mixed bag. The high repair costs are largely because of EV manufactures trying out new things, like unibodies that are very expensive to replace, lack of 3rd party mechanics trained on them, and less commonly available parts at auto stores as you mention. The great news is that none of these are inherent with EVs, the traditional manufactures are using more construction in common with their ICE counter-parts and mechanics and parts will become available with time as the market adopts it. The other bonus is that EVs need a lot less maintenance to begin with because they are mechanically much simpler and regenerative breaking does a lot to cut back on wear and tear on the parts that do experience more issues like tires and brakes.
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