Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

goodlawproject.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 121 posts

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#71

Post by c1b »

ghc wrote: post #52
c1b wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me rephrase: I am extremely familiar with the USG data management tech landscape.

I'd love to know (in as much detail as you are allowed) what you feel the strengths and weaknesses of CHEETAS is.

I cannot comment specifically on CHEETAS, but what I can say is that USG developing in house software solutions almost always produces a disastrous product that goes over budget and has extreme maintenance overhead.

To see why, you can simply ask yourself: do you think that the unelected officials overseeing government agencies that embark on enterprise software development projects have sufficient expertise and enterprise software project management experience to be able to do this well?

Furthermore, do you think that the quality of engineers that the NHS or DoD can attract with less than half of the compensation of an actual software company stands a chance at developing something good in house?

It’s unfortunately almost impossible for these projects to go right.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#72

Post by morelisp »

g8oz wrote: post #69
tptacek wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever been on public transit in DC? There are billboards all over the place (or were a decade ago when I was there last) that are clearly sales efforts targeting like 4 people. It's not that weird.

Again, not normal humans.

Absolutely more normal than someone paranoid they might reveal their MBTI.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#73

Post by mdhb »

neilv wrote: post #32
noodlesUK wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn’t even begin to surprise me. Even on a tiny scale, myself and a couple of the other top students at our university got an unsolicited phone call from palantir about 10 min after we finished our last exams congratulating us on finishing university and encouraging us to apply to Palantir. They had clearly gotten access to our exam timetable so they could call us right after we had finished. It was deeply cre…

Sounds like a good filter for culture: discourage the people who wouldn't be onboard with company approaches, and simultaneously attract the people who want to be a part of the power that the company just flexed a tiny bit.

I imagine after thinking about it for more than thirty seconds some rather obvious problems begin to emerge with this approach.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#74

Post by abawany »

educaysean wrote: post #70
mywacaday wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know someone who worked in finance HR for approx 20 years. Nearly every time the business hired someone who would have been identified as a poor fit by Meyers Briggs they wouldn't last 12 months.

Growing up in Asia, I've heard similar anecdotes about blood types. Yeah it sounds stupid in 2024, but back in the 90s, the bloodtype-personality theory was endorsed by politicians and business leaders. Pseudoscience yields anecdotes. Science yields empirical results.

You're right: astrology still has its believers.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#75

Post by ak_111 »

dwroberts wrote: post #51
cedws wrote: post #6

I just don't get it. NHS needs a big data platform so they go to a... spy tech company? Why are they so insistent that it must be Palantir that builds this, instead of choosing from a dozen of other consulting companies that don't have a dodgy track record? Ideally the NHS would just build it in house, but sadly it's a slow and bloated organisation unable to innovate (as most government managed things usually become)…

We currently have a Conservative government, and they hate the NHS. Anything they can do to sink the NHS or destroy its reputation and push people toward private healthcare is a win to them. I wouldn't be surprised if this Palantir stuff involves an extremely onerous contract, and probably terms that the NHS cannot even afford long term, and the Tories knowingly entered into it any way.

I am afraid you can't simply blame the conservative for this. This is a total societal breakdown, and I am not being dramatic if you consider other simultaneous scandals such as PPE.

By that I mean it is impressive how this could happen in one of the foremost liberal society with a large well-funded media representing the whole political spectrum, fiercely adversarial two-party politics, respect for institutional whistleblowers (so long as they don't involve foreign policy) and finally an independent civil service. All of those layers failed to put a stop to this or even to shed an intense light on it for the public. Far more than the conservatives had failed to let this get through.

In fact what is amazing is the public barely aware of its existence as a news story. Try asking a few of your non-tech friends about it. Even the twitter mob failed on this.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#76

Post by xyst »

cedws wrote: post #6

I just don't get it. NHS needs a big data platform so they go to a... spy tech company? Why are they so insistent that it must be Palantir that builds this, instead of choosing from a dozen of other consulting companies that don't have a dodgy track record? Ideally the NHS would just build it in house, but sadly it's a slow and bloated organisation unable to innovate (as most government managed things usually become)…

Because to build a dodgy, possibly unethical system. Usually the most unethical company (and one that won’t cost a shit ton of money) will be the first ones that politicians or government will pick. Sure gov can build it in house but the system itself is a PR nightmare. Any unethical use and the current administration will be blamed.

By subcontracting it out, gov has an easy out.

- “oh there was a bad subcontractor misusing the system. It WaSnT uS!1!!”

- “oh it was just one bad actor within government. We sent person to black site. ItS NoT a SyStEmIc iSSuE”

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#77

Post by ak_111 »

SushiHippie wrote: post #26
cedws wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which product specifically? As I understand Palantir has several products and the NHS isn't buying one of them but paying for something bespoke.

https://www.palantir.com/uk/healthcare/ They are using palantir foundry, which is palantir's big data platform, or how they call it: "The Ontology-Powered Operating System for the Modern Enterprise"

What they call it doesn't sound like legendary marketing that I was expecting.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#78

Post by zimpenfish »

ak_111 wrote: post #75
dwroberts wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We currently have a Conservative government, and they hate the NHS. Anything they can do to sink the NHS or destroy its reputation and push people toward private healthcare is a win to them. I wouldn't be surprised if this Palantir stuff involves an extremely onerous contract, and probably terms that the NHS cannot even afford long term, and the Tories knowingly entered into it any way.

I am afraid you can't simply blame the conservative for this. This is a total societal breakdown, and I am not being dramatic if you consider other simultaneous scandals such as PPE. By that I mean it is impressive how this could happen in one of the foremost liberal society with a large well-funded media representing the whole political spectrum, fiercely adversarial two-party politics, respect for institutional whi…

> with a large well-funded media representing the whole political spectrum

I'm reasonably sure the UK media tilts mostly rightwards with only a tiny strand on the left and a small chunk of centrism.

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#79

Post by dwroberts »

ak_111 wrote: post #75
dwroberts wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We currently have a Conservative government, and they hate the NHS. Anything they can do to sink the NHS or destroy its reputation and push people toward private healthcare is a win to them. I wouldn't be surprised if this Palantir stuff involves an extremely onerous contract, and probably terms that the NHS cannot even afford long term, and the Tories knowingly entered into it any way.

I am afraid you can't simply blame the conservative for this. This is a total societal breakdown, and I am not being dramatic if you consider other simultaneous scandals such as PPE. By that I mean it is impressive how this could happen in one of the foremost liberal society with a large well-funded media representing the whole political spectrum, fiercely adversarial two-party politics, respect for institutional whi…

> other simultaneous scandals such as PPE.

Also performed by the conservative government?

I mean that sets the precedent for kick-backs as well, so I wouldn't be surprised if, after losing the next election, a bunch of sitting Conservative MPs go and mysteriously work for Palantir (Greensill all over again and - oh and hey, David Cameron's reputation is being rehabilitated right now by having him in government again, funny that)

Re: NHS to investigate Palantir influencer campaign as possible contract breach

#80

Post by seeAls0 »

zimpenfish wrote: post #78
ak_111 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am afraid you can't simply blame the conservative for this. This is a total societal breakdown, and I am not being dramatic if you consider other simultaneous scandals such as PPE. By that I mean it is impressive how this could happen in one of the foremost liberal society with a large well-funded media representing the whole political spectrum, fiercely adversarial two-party politics, respect for institutional whi…

> with a large well-funded media representing the whole political spectrum I'm reasonably sure the UK media tilts mostly rightwards with only a tiny strand on the left and a small chunk of centrism.

[dead]
Post reply on HN