Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS • Hacker News Board

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#171

Post by bongodongobob » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:50 PM UTC

akira2501 wrote: post #137

bongodongobob wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm coming off of an entire weekend spent trying to get acceptable latency for audio recording in Linux. Just a midi controller to play a simple 3x oscillator VST with better than 250ms latency was my test case. I tried different versions of Ubuntu, Debian, different kernels, different window managers, different graphics drivers, stripping things out of the system etc. After going down the rabbit hole, I finally ripp…

I'd recommend jack audio connection kit if that's your use case. You can generally get the best latency performance that your card has to offer, and the jack connection graph is superlative, in my opinion.

The jumping off point was JACK not working actually. Pulseaudio was the only one that did. Someone mentioned ALSA so I went down that road.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#172

Post by realfeel78 » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:50 PM UTC

hereme888 wrote: post #139

Windows from an alternate universe where companies care mainly about the user's benefit. I think Linux would barely be a thing at all if Microsoft had focused on clean and performant experiences that allowed users more control, flexibility, and privacy. Instead, they put themselves through the pain and expense of pretending to care for OSS. They would have loyal customers due to the trust from a clean Windows experie…

> I think Linux would barely be a thing at all if…

So, like it still is now.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#173

Post by bongodongobob » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:52 PM UTC

arendtio wrote: post #140

bongodongobob wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm coming off of an entire weekend spent trying to get acceptable latency for audio recording in Linux. Just a midi controller to play a simple 3x oscillator VST with better than 250ms latency was my test case. I tried different versions of Ubuntu, Debian, different kernels, different window managers, different graphics drivers, stripping things out of the system etc. After going down the rabbit hole, I finally ripp…

In my experience, Windows isn't any better. With both OS you eventually have problems and if you are willing to solve them you can put a lot of time and effort into doing so. The only difference is the openness of the system. With Linux, you can easily go much deeper (for many reasons: community, available source code, multiple implementations for different system components, custom kernels). But don't get me wrong:…

Yeah I definitely hear you. For me, the tinkering was just in application settings, never the actual Windows OS settings or configuration. Out of the box, worked good enough. After getting into a full project and trying to monitor and record multi channels, etc, then yeah, there is some deep diving to be done.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#174

Post by olddustytrail » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:52 PM UTC

pjmlp wrote: post #115

Almondsetat wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Avoiding providing details is what gets you the standard Linux forum reply. Generic complaints foster generic replies

This is going the Slashdot way, thanks for bringing up some nostalgia back.

Yeah, by now we all know about your personal issues with Linus, we don't need to hear it on every single thread.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#175

Post by bongodongobob » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:54 PM UTC

washadjeffmad wrote: post #162

bongodongobob wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm coming off of an entire weekend spent trying to get acceptable latency for audio recording in Linux. Just a midi controller to play a simple 3x oscillator VST with better than 250ms latency was my test case. I tried different versions of Ubuntu, Debian, different kernels, different window managers, different graphics drivers, stripping things out of the system etc. After going down the rabbit hole, I finally ripp…

If you're sticking with linux for audio, go ahead and crib a little from AVLinux[1] or UbuntuStudio[2]. I feel like with all the modern "conveniences", things that were simpler two decades ago have gotten a lot harder! [1] http://www.bandshed.net/avlinux/ [2] https://ubuntustudio.org/tour/audio/

I did Ubuntu Studio in the beginning and had the same problem with JACK not working so bailed on it as I'm not familiar and didn't want all the bloat. That's where I got the idea to try a different kernel.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#176

Post by cesarb » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:55 PM UTC

dagmx wrote: post #160

exabrial wrote: post #127

I don't understand why people like XP so much. Windows 2000 was the ultimate OS: lean, fast, focused, and absolutely zero crapware installed. No stupid internet accounts needed to run your local OS and it did what it was supposed to do.

XP was likely the first memorable intro to windows for many developers in the home context. It was designed to be appealing to look at and a fresh coat of paint. By comparison, you’d be hard pressed to find a non-enthusiast who really remembers the differences between 95/98/ME/2000 because they largely looked similar. Unlike 2000, it was also aimed at home use. The prior home use system was ME which was also not very…

> XP was likely the first memorable intro to windows for many developers in the home context.

(emphasis mine)

IIRC, there were two separate lineages of Windows. There was the "home" lineage which went 3.1, 95, 98, ME, XP, and the "business" lineage which went NT 3.1, NT 4, 2000, XP; for those using Windows in the home context, it's likely they jumped from 9x to XP (possibly with a stop at ME in between, but IIRC Windows ME was somewhat disliked).

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#177

Post by ThatPlayer » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:55 PM UTC

Almondsetat wrote: post #119

recursive wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this necessarily represents obsession. It just means they care about gaming at least as much "kernel level monitoring". As a baseline, I don't think there are many people who care much about that. I'm not sure what it is.

Transpose this gaming obsession to other facets of life and see how it goes. Imagine if most cars were modeled after Lamborghinis and people complained about the lack of turbo or carbon seats when hopping on your Honda Civic. Imagine if most parks were modeled after football fields and people complained about the lack of goals and lines in your backyard. Imagine if most knifes were modeled after big damascus blades a…

No one's complaining about your Linux if that's what you want to use. The issue remains that for my personal wants, which includes gaming, Linux doesn't fulfill them.

If you gave me a dull knife to carve a turkey or fillet a fish, I would definitely complain about it not being sharp enough. Most people probably have a sharper knife than a table knife for cooking, is that a sharpness obsession?

It's about picking the right tool for the job. On my home server, I run Linux; my gaming computer runs Windows. If you wanna keep going with the knife analogy, look at how many types of kitchen knives there are. There is no knife that does everything just as well as all the others. Asking for a bread knife for cutting a loaf isn't an attack on every other knife.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#178

Post by StillBored » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:55 PM UTC

The theming/window manager/basic UI groups at MS seem like they are either incompetent or just Aholes. Largely because they seem to remove features during rewrites and then discover they need them back, a few years later. Ex: windows 3.x could do "dark mode", as well as any number of other things that got ripped out. Yes, having a theming manager as complete as the one in say KDE that can create themes to match most current and historic OSs is "hard" but looking at the code doesn't seem like something professionals paid to maintain the largest desktop OS by market share should be incapable of it.

So, it seems to me that no one should have been allowed to ship a windows theme/WM that couldn't at least support a win95 style theme. AKA you don't get to merge it until it can do these half dozen simple things. Similarly the task bar, ok nice you created a new one, but can it be positioned on the left side of the screen, or have the start menu moved? Then no, it doesn't get merged.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#179

Post by AtlasBarfed » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:56 PM UTC

tiffanyh wrote: post #19

swells34 wrote: post #4

Ya know, I've never had a Linux box that had any of the problems listed about modern windows. Also all the advantages listed about Windows XP are also present in Linux... But I've never paid Microsoft for an OS that showed me ads against my will in my Start Menu, so maybe I just don't know what I'm missing.

> "all the advantages listed about Windows XP are also present in Linux" You mean, are present in Linux TODAY . Installing Linux 22-years ago, when XP shipped, was hugely painful and only the most technical would attempt it. Windows XP marked the begin of an era when corporations replaced analog processes with digital. It sounds so foreign now, but in the late 90s - it was still common for corporations to send printe…

Red Hat wasn't that bad back in the day. It was three CDs and I was up and running on a pentium pro.

Did it look as good as XP? no. It worked though.

Re: Windows XP 2024 Edition is everything I want from a new OS

#180

Post by mrweasel » Sun, Jan 07, 2024, 7:56 PM UTC

tiffanyh wrote: post #19

swells34 wrote: post #4

Ya know, I've never had a Linux box that had any of the problems listed about modern windows. Also all the advantages listed about Windows XP are also present in Linux... But I've never paid Microsoft for an OS that showed me ads against my will in my Start Menu, so maybe I just don't know what I'm missing.

> "all the advantages listed about Windows XP are also present in Linux" You mean, are present in Linux TODAY . Installing Linux 22-years ago, when XP shipped, was hugely painful and only the most technical would attempt it. Windows XP marked the begin of an era when corporations replaced analog processes with digital. It sounds so foreign now, but in the late 90s - it was still common for corporations to send printe…

> Installing Linux 22-years ago, when XP shipped, was hugely painful

There was a weird sweet spot for Linux around 2000-2004, very short, where most things just worked. Sure, there was very little gaming, but you could get by just fine and installations was reasonably simple, Redhat, Slackware, Debian, SuSE, Mandrake, Caldera, they all just worked. Sure you had to be a little selective regarding hardware, but it wasn't a massive issue.

Interaction with Windows mostly worked without issues, but as Windows XP became more dominate, and especially as Internet Explorer and newer versions of Office took over, things got worse. Still for a few short years, those of us who got into Linux in that tiny windows of time, didn't actually struggle as much as people think. We could do online shopping, word processing, online banking and a little casual gaming. Come 2005 and that was all gone.