FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

Post by lostlogin » Sat, Jan 06, 2024, 9:11 PM UTC

jessriedel wrote: post #179

What's the back of the envelope on whether the 737 Max is more dangerous than driving? 1,300 aircraft have been built since the first started flying in 2017, with two deadly crashes. I don't know how many miles those have accumulated, but presumably it's of order 4k miles per day per aircraft, and maybe 3 years (1000 days) of flying to date per aircraft on average, giving a very rough estimate of a few billion miles?…

Post by upon_drumhead » Sat, Jan 06, 2024, 9:12 PM UTC

olig15 wrote: post #159

Miraste wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two of those are manufacturing mistakes, and it seems likely the door one is as well. Not that that helps the passengers, but they're not systemic design flaws. That anti-icing system is deranged, though. They effectively installed a timed detonator on the engines and want a safety exemption for it.

Ah you’re right. They’re not design flaws, just manufacturing issues, so sign me up for the first flight when the max flies again… People falling out the sky because the wing falls off because someone forgot to bolt it on aren’t going to care if it’s a design issue or a manufacturing issue. Boeing is doing both, so the blame lies with them either way.

Post by binoct » Sat, Jan 06, 2024, 9:14 PM UTC

nerdjon wrote: post #228

ugiox wrote: post #151

How to avoid the 737 Max? Fly only airlines that don’t have it. Luckily there are still a few around in Europe. Since the two fatal crashes I have avoided doing flights with 737s.

I have made the decision that unless I absolutely can’t avoid it I am avoiding Boeing for the near future entirely. But a 737 max is full no go for me no matter what the situation is. I will do multiple stops before stepping foot on one. Personally I fly exclusively JetBlue in the US and they use Airbus almost exclusively. They have a few of whatever that other brand is. No Boeing.

Post by letitbeirie » Sat, Jan 06, 2024, 9:15 PM UTC

ironmagma wrote: post #45

aplummer wrote: post #28

Two days ago before we got on one of these planes I said to my partner “don’t worry, it’s the most scrutinized plane in history”.

Yeah it's really not. Age is the only thing that will do that.

Post by marcosdumay » Sat, Jan 06, 2024, 9:15 PM UTC

codeflo wrote: post #208

_cenw wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boeing made the 737 NG until 2019. It also allegedly had issues with the contractor Ducommun making the airframe, including "hammering alignment holes into place". But it wasn't nearly as problematic of a plane. The Max is a desperate attempt to compete with the A320 neo ("new engine option"). It is the aviation efficiency gain equivalent of a die shrink, except these engines get bigger, and while Airbus had space to…

> pilots not having to do an entirely new type certificate And consequently, their intention seems to be to bend the rules about the validity of the existing certifications to the max (no pun intended). At what point can an agency rule that Boeing no longer follows the spirit of the pilot certification rules?