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JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

avherald.com

111–120 of 515 posts

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It should have been 384. If 10,000 people die but 1,000,000 are "saved", do we not mourn the 10,000 people? Have a heart my man. What if you were one of those 10,000?

If a "normal" outcome for such an event would have been much closer to 1,000,000 being killed, then yes it would be wonderful if 990,000 were saved. Sure, we mourn the dead, but we can still be happy for the saved.

Still, the word miracle would be inappropriate.

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#112
post #98
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it does. "a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency."

Rather amusing to me how many people are downvoting this comment.

Yeah, it's rough out there for pedants.

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#113

This is why you follow cabin crew instructions and DO NOT CARRY YOUR LUGGAGE out of the aircraft in an emergency. Your luggage is not worth more than a fellow passengers life. Contrast this with evacuation footage of western passenger planes..

Members of my family require medication (epipen, some various pills), and I keep that along with a flashlight (in case I need to administer in pitch black) in a small haversack. I would probably try to take that with me, as I would hate to survive the crash but then have a fatal medical event in the aftermath and not have the tools. I do feel conflicted since the no luggage mantra has been drilled in for decades.

[flagged]

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#115
post #52

We really need a paywall mark. Too bad linking to av....ld would probably shut down the site for today.

Anyone here from one of the large CDN providers want to reach out to AV Herald and offer him some free services? It’s such a useful and informative resource. Too bad it’s super slow when accessed in AU/NZ and I guess outside US/EU.

Earlier today it was very slow, and often timing out, from the EU too. I haven't tried again since.

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#116

I'll speculate: this looks like textbook runway invasion where miscommunication leads to two different aircrafts being allowed on a runway at the same time. Reminds me of LATAM 2213, which led to the very first Airbus 320 neo being written off [1]. Essentially, clearance to enter a runway has to be expressively given and confirmed in non-ubiquitous language ("Flight ABC requesting clearance to enter runway 01"). Yet…

> invasion

you mean incursion

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#117
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

There are huge numbers of opportunities to trade off inconvenience against reduced death. For example, we could prohibit radios in cars because the music and adjustment can be distracting and lead to collisions. Or ban cars entirely since they're much more dangerous than walking and public transport. We could require everyone to wear an N95 all winter. Ban phones for the entirety of the flight, and prohibit books as…

The inconvenience vs risk threshold here is similar to bucking a seatbelt which is hard to argue is a poor investment.

Aircraft may be very safe on a per mile basis, but those risks are extremely concentrated around takeoff and landing. Which are fast events, so the risk per second is relatively high even though flying is generally much safer than driving.

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How many deaths do you expect keeping passengers from being distracted at these times would prevent? As of today: 379.

Passengers were using their phones during landing (including at least one that posted footage from inside the plane on social media), so...no? Incredibly, people can walk and chew gum at the same time. This includes the ability to refocus their attention when they experience unusual events.

You're allowed to use phones during landing; they don't present much of a challenge for evacuation.

You're not allowed to use laptops or have the tray down.

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#119
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

There are huge numbers of opportunities to trade off inconvenience against reduced death. For example, we could prohibit radios in cars because the music and adjustment can be distracting and lead to collisions. Or ban cars entirely since they're much more dangerous than walking and public transport. We could require everyone to wear an N95 all winter. Ban phones for the entirety of the flight, and prohibit books as…

In this case, however, the impact is knowable:

https://etsc.eu/increasing-the-survival-rate-in-aircraft-acc...

Furthermore, distracted or unprepared passengers impact the evacuation of others trapped behind them. I’ve participated in evacuation training for flight attendants and have personally witnessed how a bungled jump down evacuation slide led to a 5-10 second delay. This was equated with ~20 fatalities due to smoke inhalation in the simulation.

Re: JAL A359 at Tokyo collided with Coast Guard DH8C on runway and burst into flames

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Members of my family require medication (epipen, some various pills), and I keep that along with a flashlight (in case I need to administer in pitch black) in a small haversack. I would probably try to take that with me, as I would hate to survive the crash but then have a fatal medical event in the aftermath and not have the tools. I do feel conflicted since the no luggage mantra has been drilled in for decades.

[flagged]

Not the OP but I wouldn't call lifesaving medical equipment like an EpiPen a convenience.

Though it would be better to just stick it in a pocket. I always carry a flashlight on my keychain as well.

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