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Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

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Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#121

Post by OatmealDome »

kmeisthax wrote: post #82

So... Nintendo made the same mistake twice? For context, the Wii used GameSpy under-the-hood. You weren't necessarily required to use it (as evidenced by EA shipping their own system) but most developers did. The reason why Wii online was shut down was specifically because GameSpy got bought out and started massively increasing their server hosting costs. Of course, that's a little different from the Rendez-Vous situ…

NEX is still used by many games on the Nintendo Switch, so I don't think it's another GameSpy situation.

That being said, Nintendo has started using an in-house replacement system called "NPLN" in some of their more recent titles. Some examples include Splatoon 3 and Pokémon Scarlet/Violet. (They've shown no indication of converting older titles to the new system, however.)

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#122

Post by Aerroon »

Dalewyn wrote: post #96
easton wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless it’s a 32-bit Mac come January or a machine running windows Which I’m fine with, but it’s not like Valve is magical somehow. If your machine isn’t still getting Chromium builds they can’t build Steam for it, you still need to buy new hardware. And the game consoles (less) often let you play old games on new hardware.

>in which case you’re screwed until you buy new hardware. Windows 10 runs on anything that will emit a clock signal, and Windows 11 can be forced onto hardware it doesn't officially like. I don't like Windows 7 support being dropped either, in large part because the dropping comes due to CEF used by Steam, but it's not like the hardware concerned becomes useless with no way out.

>Windows 10 runs on anything that will emit a clock signal

It runs extremely poorly on low power hardware. Poorly enough that I consider it unusable. Windows 7 ran fine on the same hardware previously.

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#123

Post by Aerroon »

makeitdouble wrote: post #60
phone8675309 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I don't buy a console that doesn't have a functional jailbreak/softmod. You can't count on these companies to care about the consumer past the initial purchase. If you can jailbreak your console there are plenty of sites that preserve the released games that you can install after the online services are shut down.

We've moved so far into the "you won't own anything" lane that it got me thinking back to how we deal with the rest of the world. For instance we actively dissuade people from taking photos during foreign trips or at the restaurant because they're supposed to be enjoying the experience, instead of viewing it trough a viewfinder. We haven't reached a point yet where people are arguing they should have a copy of the ti…

I have actually found this problem. Some foods that I enjoyed aren't sold anymore because the company shut down and it made me sad. It made me reconsider whether it's worth trying new stuff from questionable companies, because even if I find something good it will probably disappear anyway.

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#124

Post by kiwijamo »

slowhadoken wrote: post #78
easton wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless it’s a 32-bit Mac come January or a machine running windows Which I’m fine with, but it’s not like Valve is magical somehow. If your machine isn’t still getting Chromium builds they can’t build Steam for it, you still need to buy new hardware. And the game consoles (less) often let you play old games on new hardware.

My Deck just runs all those old windows games using proton. I mean, Windows subsystems runs Linux. You don’t even need VMs anymore. It’s not magic it’s just portability.

The majority of my steam collection is games that will not run on the steam deck or Linux. Out of 15 I have, only three works on. YMMV but doesn't look like 'all' these windows games unfortunately. May be more of an issue with the type of games I like, i.e. Civilisation, Age of Empires, etc.

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#125

Post by tsimionescu »

danparsonson wrote: post #86
makeitdouble wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've moved so far into the "you won't own anything" lane that it got me thinking back to how we deal with the rest of the world. For instance we actively dissuade people from taking photos during foreign trips or at the restaurant because they're supposed to be enjoying the experience, instead of viewing it trough a viewfinder. We haven't reached a point yet where people are arguing they should have a copy of the ti…

I agree that we should think about whether or not it's better to let the past go and just enjoy experiences during their time rather than expecting them to be around forever, but I think your tiramisu example actually makes the opposite point - recipes like that are in the public domain and there will always be kitchens if you want to make one, whereas an online game server is a closed system that disappears if it's…

While recipes are not copyrightable, they are not automatically public either. A restaurant can consider its recipes trade secrets, and sue any employee that discloses them and win. Even photographing the chef's recipe book or something as an outside person would be punishable via trade secret laws. Famously, Coca Cola's recipe is supposed to be a closely guarded secret, for example.

So, while of course there are many widely known and available tiramisu recipes, a specific recipe from a specific restaurant is not necessarily so. Just in passing, this is something that many people who wish for an end to software copyright forget: the alternative to copyright is not at all free public software, it is trade secret Linux "recipes".

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#126

Post by smaudet »

YoshiRulz wrote: post #94
wsve wrote: post #83

Now that we've seen this pattern emerge multiple times in the past (people losing a large chunk of their games due to the shutdown of the online catalog), I think it begs for a killer feature in the future: the ability to burn the games you've purchased from the online catalog onto write-once blank cartridges. Distributing games via physical copies is already a profit loss compared to distributing them via an online…

This is a great idea, but doesn't solve the problem of _game servers_ shutting down.

Or even general availability of games...

Purchase a game console, why shouldn't the store remain functional indefinitely?

Yes, I get operating costs for your store front, but the standard should be, _if you are operating a market it should not be yours to control_.

Monopolies are bad in all forms, game stores should be operable by anyone, period.

And yes companies can protect themselves by disqualification of warranty for 3rd party stores, but that should be the consumer's choice, not some arbitrary CEOs decision.

We should buy your product because it offers something worth buying, not because you needed a subscription to bump your numbers...

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#127

Post by slowhadoken »

prmoustache wrote: post #116
slowhadoken wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Valve has the perfect setup right now. Your desktop, laptop, or Deck can connect to Steam.

Isn't that out of scope of the discussion? Valve doesn't provide the online game capabilities of title and cannot guarantee you will be able to play online to all sort of old titles whose published shut down the servers.

It’s within the scope of the discussion. Nintendo should centralize its games into a single universal platform like Steam. Now that Valve has a successful handheld console it’s even more relevant than ever.

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#128

Post by 14 »

daydream wrote: post #69
philistine wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at the one company who owns a vibrant operating system: Microsoft. They dropped the original Xbox like a box of bricks. They shut down those old servers quite rapidly. With the Xbox 360 however, they will stop the ability to buy games on an original Xbox 360 next year. That's a long era of support! https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2023/08/17/xbox-360-store-will-c... I'm fairly convinced new credit card standards are…

Looks like the Xbox 360 will get more than 18 years of online store support. That's a really long time considering it launched in 2005. I would take 18 total years online support for the Switch. It's been out for 6 so far, so even if I "only" got 12 years out of my unit (I just bought one recently) that would be pretty good... ...but not excellent. I bought a Wii in 2008 and after a long time in storage I pulled it o…

I got my original NES over 30 years ago. I had to swap a couple capacitors but still hook it up occasionally and show the kids games like Duck Hunt(required an old tv as well) and Tetris and Blaster Master. These digital games that suddenly stop working simply due to no server support is a hard pill to swallow. At that point I really think companies should be forced to release source code and keys and allow anyone who wants to offer support a chance to run the games.

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#129

Post by slowhadoken »

HideousKojima wrote: post #107
slowhadoken wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like the obligation falls on developers and studios. It’s Capcom’s responsibility to keep Street Fighter X Tekken working because Capcom is the seller. Fortunately the community usually warns buyers about abandonware and you can always get a refund.

Also if you're playing on Linux a lot of those older games run perfectly through WINE, better than they run on modern Windows.

wine is rolled into proton.

Re: Nintendo Network shutdown – The beginning of the end

#130

Post by chrisandchris »

daydream wrote: post #69
philistine wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at the one company who owns a vibrant operating system: Microsoft. They dropped the original Xbox like a box of bricks. They shut down those old servers quite rapidly. With the Xbox 360 however, they will stop the ability to buy games on an original Xbox 360 next year. That's a long era of support! https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2023/08/17/xbox-360-store-will-c... I'm fairly convinced new credit card standards are…

Looks like the Xbox 360 will get more than 18 years of online store support. That's a really long time considering it launched in 2005. I would take 18 total years online support for the Switch. It's been out for 6 so far, so even if I "only" got 12 years out of my unit (I just bought one recently) that would be pretty good... ...but not excellent. I bought a Wii in 2008 and after a long time in storage I pulled it o…

I still have an Xbox 360, and as I'm not a regular gamer it's still my go-to. We maybe bought in in '06-'08. if they would shut down only services (and I could still play offline), that's totally ok for me. 15 years for a console is a long time.
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