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Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

whitehouse.gov

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Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#161

Post by dheuoddjo »

iudqnolq wrote: post #147
dheuoddjo wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> black people would not be 3.5 times more likely to be arrested for possession than white people While on its face true, this isn’t taking into account things like recidivism or multiple charges. That’s to say the average black person has more priors and is more likely to have multiple charges when charged compared to the average white.

I think the thing you said about priors is repeating a talking point about prosecution or sentencing disparities that isn't particularly relevant in the context of an arrest. I have no idea what you mean about multiple charges.

> I think the thing you said about priors is repeating a talking point about prosecution or sentencing disparities that isn't particularly relevant in the context of an arrest.

Arrests don’t occur in a vacuum. The prior convictions are known and are a factor.

> I have no idea what you mean about multiple charges.

Person A is smoking pot and is arrested. Person B is smoking pot wearing a bloody t shirt with a knife in his hand. If you’re more likely to engage in criminal activity, you’re more likely to be smoking pot while engaging in criminal activity (again, on average).

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#162

Post by gnicholas »

zdragnar wrote: post #6

I don't disagree that this is good for those involved or affected. However, nothing stops the same from happening to someone tomorrow. The past several administrations have been relying too heavily on executive fiat for the optics. The DEA needs to reschedule it. Anything else is at best a band-aid, if not simple lip service to buy votes.

For those wondering, it looks like scheduling is done by the DEA, FDA, and Congress: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Substances_Act#:~:t....

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#163

Post by akerl_ »

4RealFreedom wrote: post #94
cm2187 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Why does fentanyl kill? Because people buy it and don't understand the strength. Regulation would take care of that. So what's your argument here?

I would recommend https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/why-are-drug-dealers-p... , but the TL;DR is roughly "drug addicts are highly motivated by their addiction to find the most powerful drugs they can, to get the most powerful high they can get. Fentanyl being so strong that people overdose is, in this regard, a selling point"

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#164

Post by zrail »

dragonwriter wrote: post #133
aaomidi wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The president can however pardon in states using “emergency powers”. Our constitution does not define the breadth and depth of emergency powers and it would be up for both congress and SCOTUS to decide that the president can’t do that. I would hope that a president would just say fuck it and try this though. As much as I want things to be done “the right way”, I value lives of folks more than my neurodivergent desire…

> The president can however pardon in states using “emergency powers”. No, he can't. > Our constitution does not define the breadth and depth of emergency powers In our system, federal powers not defined in the Constitution do not exist .

Yep. The 10th amendment, in it's entirety:

> The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#165

Post by mutualaidwins »

more_corn wrote: post #139
unstatusthequo wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, not all states have drugs laws that are absurd. At least one decent thing about California, Oregon, and Washington is some sensibility about legalizing or at least not prosecuting non-dangerous drugs. But, sad to say the ultra religious/conservative states are still stuck in legacy reasoning and it will take generations to change minds. And yes, alcohol is much worse than marijuana, shrooms, LSD.

Decriminalizing drugs and other progressive changes to law enforcement have led to some problems in San Francisco and Portland. There’s a real sense of the breakdown of social order.

[dead]

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#166

Post by leviathant »

dilippkumar wrote: post #75

As an immigrant, this stood out to me: > ... I, Joseph R. Biden Jr., do hereby grant a full, complete, and unconditional pardon to all current United States citizens and lawful permanent residents who ... > ... This pardon does not apply to individuals who were non-citizens not lawfully present in the United States at the time of their offense. In the first of the above, it specifically states that it applies to citi…

>So, what happens to someone who had a valid immigration status, but was not a lawful permanent resident? For example, someone on a student or a tourist visa?

I brought my wife over on the 90 day fiancee visa well before there was a TV show about it, and mostly because it was the only way we could hang out. Thankfully we lucked out, and celebrated our 20th anniversary earlier this year.

But to the point: When you're dealing with DHS and immigration, it's made absolutely clear that if you screw anything up, you're kicked out of the country and it's going to be a ballache to get back in. It's not surprising that they were not included in the blanket pardon, and I think that's actually pretty reasonable, even though I also think that incarceration over marijuana possession is absurd and has been pretty devastating to the lives of millions of people and the communities they live in.

The amount of work you have to do to qualify for a visa, and to move between the different statuses (there are fun periods where your status is just... pending. When we went through this, there was nothing you have to show for this except for a generic looking letter from DHS. All your fancy documentation is sitting in a US Gov't inbox somewhere while they make sure you're not a terrorist) and, frankly, if you manage to get arrested for smoking weed while you're on a visa, you're kind of an idiot.

We didn't even travel outside the country until my wife got her full-fledged citizenship. And when she applied for that, they gave her a hard time over the speeding tickets she'd gotten while here.

Whether you agree with the concept or not, visitors to the country are told pretty clearly that the rules apply extra hard to them, and the consequences of not following very basic rules are going to be extra inconvenient. You get caught breaking the law, you risk losing your visa status and losing the ability to ever visit the country again.

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#167

Post by fyrn_ »

This pardon applies only to federal possession and use sentences, still a nice gesture, but it's a small percentage of convictions as federal prosecution of these charges is rare. More important for it's symbolic effects then for the actual direct results

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#169

Post by sigzero »

Digory wrote: post #36
codexb wrote: post #7

This will have virtually zero effect. The president only has the power to pardon people convicted or accused of violating federal law and prosecuted in federal court. The problem is that nearly all people arrested for simple possession of marijuana aren't charged under federal law nor prosecuted in federal court. They are charged under state law that similarly outlaws marijuana possession and prosecuted in state cour…

As the proclamation says, the District of Columbia's local laws are technically federal laws. So it wipes out the convictions of a good number of people in one of our major cities. I can't quite tell if this applies to military convictions. That would be the other area where the Federal government takes the time to prosecute something as minor as mere possession or use. Another interesting question: does this actuall…

> I can't quite tell if this applies to military convictions.

No, because it would still violate the UCMJ. The UCMJ would have to change.

Re: Granting pardon for the offense of simple possession of or use of marijuana

#170

Post by loeg »

tptacek wrote: post #152
4RealFreedom wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So are you going to tell me what it is then?

I don't have to. We've had a nationwide epidemic of deaths from regulated, labeled opiates, which is a fact that refutes your argument without requiring me to provide an alternative.

The overdoses per abuser from regulated, labeled opiates is on the order of at least 100x lower than illicit opioids. The consistent formulation is hugely safer than street drugs with inconsistent dose.
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