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Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

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Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#621

Post by natch »

squarefoot wrote: post #158
intrasight wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least they are not charging a license fee for the connector.

Probably having the brand Tesla exposed to other cars drivers will be enough PR.

Tesla has plenty of PR for the brand already.

But people will be able to compare how fast Teslas charge, and how Teslas are able to just plug in without using an app or swiping a credit card, and how the owners can watch YouTube or Netflix while charging. Things like these will be the real eye opener, not the brand exposure.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#622

Post by keep_reading »

rekoil wrote: post #409
ClassyJacket wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a horrible, heavy connector.

It's big, but it really doesn't matter in practice. Yes, J1772 looks nicer and is easier to handle, but it can't pump as much wattage as CCS2, and in the end that's watt (:P) matters.

It matters when it's -20C and the cable can't bend

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#623

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #53
grecy wrote: post #2

Stellantis are the only remaining holdout. It seems inevitable they'll jump on board too.

If they are the last domino, they also have the worst negotiation position. Whatever number Tesla says will be their cost.

>Whatever number Tesla says will be their cost.

There's no number. They won't have to pay Tesla a dime. It's an open standard now.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#624

Post by samstave »

akouri wrote: post #195

I am the founder of Starlight Charging[1]. We are working on crazy-low-cost L2 chargers for multifamily apartments. Plug-and-charge is a sine-qua-non for us. One still major unsolved problem is the lack of agreement on a standard for payment/powerline communication from the EVSE to the vehicle. OCPP 2.0.1 and ISO 15118 is supposed to bring "Plug and Charge" capabilities -- this, in theory, would allow drivers to simp…

Has anyone pointed out that the people who own Teslas, are likely to also own several of the other cars such as audi and porche?

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#625

Post by tristan957 »

grecy wrote: post #610
sangnoir wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The billions in federal government subsidies (funded by the Inflation Reduction Act) will more than make up for any potential licensing fees. I wouldn't be surprised if Tesla is paying other manufactures to switch; we may never know as the agreements are confidential.

Please link to an article that documents a single subsidy that Tesla got from the government.

The federal government is currently running a program where they will give you a $7500 tax break for buying a qualifying electric vehicle. Tesla, being the go-to for electric vehicles at the moment, is obviously a large beneficiary of this, even going so far as to adjust the pricing on one of its vehicles to meet the program's requirements.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#626

Post by sib »

shiftpgdn wrote: post #412
akouri wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you mean it will _gross_ Tesla $20. From my research, Tesla is (currently) not making much on energy delivered. That _will_ certainly change in the future though.

Using Texas as an example: 10-80% on a Model S/X is 70kwh. Rate billed to customers will vary from 30-50c/kwh at time of charge. Spot in Texas typically ranges from 5c to 15c/kwh. Assuming charge equipment is fully depreciated all they need to pay is maintenance and network cost, which is marginal across a bank of 20 chargers. 70kwh x 25c = $17.50.

Using California as an example, they are charging $0.12 / kWh more for non-Teslas than for Teslas. I don't see any reason to assume that delta would be different in other locations.

Since the Tesla-Supercharging business is running at break-even, you're looking at something like $8.40 for a non-Tesla adding 70kwh.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#627

Post by sib »

shiftpgdn wrote: post #221
sib wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure how much margin that Tesla will be making on the charging. I don't think the financial details of these deals have been disclosed. Adding lots of revenue but with no margin doesn't really add value to Tesla. (Of course, to the extent they get funding from the government or other manufacturers to offset the capex required for building out more stations and chargers, that's great for Tesla & anyone.)

In states where they are registered as an energy provider? A lot. A 10-80% charge will net Tesla $20. Comparatively a gas station that refills a midsize car with a 20 gallon tank will only net $6.

Using California as an example, they are charging $0.12 / kWh more for non-Teslas than for Teslas. I don't see any reason to assume that delta would be different in other locations.

Since the Tesla-Supercharging business is running at break-even, you're looking at something like $8.40 for a non-Tesla adding 70kwh. So that's pretty close to your gas vehicle estimate.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#628

Post by ska »

namdnay wrote: post #382
akouri wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tap & Pay with a ccard still requires you to fiddle with a station and slows you down. If you are plugging in at home (which is our target market), the fewer interactions needed the better. Imagine every time you get home you need to take your wallet out, tap the machine, wait for some 3rd party api to talk to the charger in the dimly lit basement, and then and only then you can leave. This is like 30 seconds of your…

If it’s a multi-family home system, why not just use contactless badges/fobs to identify each family? When you move in you sign the contract, give your bank details and get a fob. Then just badge with the fob to charge

In that case they often already have a fob to enter shared (secured) parking anyway, that also works on doors, and is registered with the building management...

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#629

Post by grecy »

tristan957 wrote: post #625
grecy wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please link to an article that documents a single subsidy that Tesla got from the government.

The federal government is currently running a program where they will give you a $7500 tax break for buying a qualifying electric vehicle. Tesla, being the go-to for electric vehicles at the moment, is obviously a large beneficiary of this, even going so far as to adjust the pricing on one of its vehicles to meet the program's requirements.

Tesla are getting exactly $0 of this money (it goes to the customer).

Also, every other automaker can make cars that qualify. In fact, many already do!

Also note Tesla do not make a single PEHV, so in fact plenty of automakers make vehicles that qualify and Tesla doesn't.

Here's the lists:

EVs: https://electrek.co/2023/11/07/which-electric-vehicles-still...

PEHVs: https://electrek.co/2023/11/07/which-electric-vehicles-still...

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#630

Post by hawk01 »

phkahler wrote: post #123
InTheArena wrote: post #57

I think people are missing the big story here. This is Tesla winning the charging network battle (it wasn't close before this). Any EV car (which will eventually be all cars) will immediately be available for Tesla's supercharger network. This gives Tesla a massive revenue stream and scale to grow that network even bigger. Anyone who wants their superchargers has to also support all Teslas.

Nah. The real win here is for the public. The "standard" charging plug and cables weigh a LOT, so much that my elderly mother probably couldn't use one. The "standard" also mandates the use of PowerLine Communication chips even though the signal is not over the high power conductor. We are all better off just biting the bullet now and changing everything over to the Tesla plug.

Can other manufacturers produce Tesla charging cable else we're setting up a lightning cable vs USB-c situation for future us
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