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Where Johnny Cash came from

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Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#91

Post by Loughla »

xeromal wrote: post #75
mcmoor wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can it be argued that work is miserable for everyone, including children? Current trends doesn't only seek to abolish child worker, it aims to free it from everyone. Of course, whether it'd actually be better for everyone or it'd actually be stable is another can of worm entirely.

I think humans are hard wired to work or to at least produce something to find value and I personally think relieving everyone from forced work would produce a lot of aimless and suicidal beings. Not every is going to appreciate the freedom and start producing pottery. I'm wholly aware that I am influenced by a Puritan work ethic

I think it's less about "work" and more about reason for being. Work is sort of the easiest, lowest friction way to find that.

Post-scarcity and post-work society takes a formal effort for people to find purpose. It requires that we really try to find things that are valuable and that we enjoy.

But I do not believe we will live, as a society, to see the end of scarcity or jobs. We'll kill ourselves way before we get to that point.

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#92

Post by nsxwolf »

jmspring wrote: post #57
acjohnson55 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think there's any evidence to indicate that the generations who worked through childhood are any better on average. There are folks who turned that into habits that unlocked productivity and happiness in life. There are others who just got exploited. To me, what's important is building the intuition for the connection between practice and achievement, which is a subtly different thing. It's not hard work for…

I disagree to a point. We see millenials/Gen-Z expecting promotions and large salaries for little to no work history and at most normal productivity. There is definitely a connection missed between effort and reward.

Millenials are like 40 now. When do they finally get the promotion and salary?

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#93

Post by rograndom »

User23 wrote: post #3

I highly recommend his autobiography. It gives some detail on his time growing up picking cotton, among many other interesting anecdotes.

“I’m not the smartest guy in the world, but I’m certainly not the dumbest. I mean, I’ve read books like "The Unbearable Lightness of Being" and "Love in the Time of Cholera", and I think I’ve understood them. They’re about girls, right? Just kidding. But I have to say my all-time favorite book is Johnny Cash’s autobiography "Cash" by Johnny Cash.” ― Nick Hornby, High Fidelity

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#94

Post by PM_me_your_math »

schneems wrote: post #23
tshirthoodie wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the ongoing legacy of “I will do this no matter what” and being exploited If you're willing to do it no matter what, you're begging to be exploited. That's the entire history of the labor movement in a sentence.

> you’re begging to be exploited A “yes, and” pivot: you’re going to be exploited, you should be begging for a union. I’ve been musing on what an open source (users/creators) union would look like. The best of us write software in this “no matter what” category. How could we collectively support them while they support us and we support each other?

[dead]

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#95

Post by hereonout2 »

nsxwolf wrote: post #92
jmspring wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree to a point. We see millenials/Gen-Z expecting promotions and large salaries for little to no work history and at most normal productivity. There is definitely a connection missed between effort and reward.

Millenials are like 40 now. When do they finally get the promotion and salary?

Depends on the definition, but only the very oldest have hit 40, many in their 30s and some still in their 20s. It's too broad to be of use here, those entering the workforce in 2006 were in a different world from those doing so in 2020.

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#96

Post by DontchaKnowit »

khazhoux wrote: post #47
briHass wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If nothing else, it should humble you and make you appreciate how lucky 'you' are now to have found and be good at one of few remaining white-collar jobs that pay well. That list of high paying jobs is shrinking rapidly, and it's pretty reasonable to think that in 20 years, software engineers are going to be the miners/mill-workers of the previous generation.

Yes, it is very important that people feel guilty about having good jobs

What? They were talking about gratitude not guilt

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#97

Post by phone8675309 »

jmspring wrote: post #57
acjohnson55 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think there's any evidence to indicate that the generations who worked through childhood are any better on average. There are folks who turned that into habits that unlocked productivity and happiness in life. There are others who just got exploited. To me, what's important is building the intuition for the connection between practice and achievement, which is a subtly different thing. It's not hard work for…

I disagree to a point. We see millenials/Gen-Z expecting promotions and large salaries for little to no work history and at most normal productivity. There is definitely a connection missed between effort and reward.

> millenials/Gen-Z expecting promotions and large salaries for little to no work history

Any time I see this I always wonder "what does the speaker consider a large salary?". Do you mean a living wage where one doesn't have to live with three other people in a rat/roach infested slumlord apartment?

Re: Where Johnny Cash came from

#98

Post by phone8675309 »

xeromal wrote: post #75
mcmoor wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can it be argued that work is miserable for everyone, including children? Current trends doesn't only seek to abolish child worker, it aims to free it from everyone. Of course, whether it'd actually be better for everyone or it'd actually be stable is another can of worm entirely.

I think humans are hard wired to work or to at least produce something to find value and I personally think relieving everyone from forced work would produce a lot of aimless and suicidal beings. Not every is going to appreciate the freedom and start producing pottery. I'm wholly aware that I am influenced by a Puritan work ethic

> Not every is going to appreciate the freedom and start producing pottery.

You're right - some may "do nothing", but the kind of people that would "do nothing" if nobody were forced to work to live are the kind of people, by and large, that do just enough to get by.

Even if we instituted a generous UBI, people would still have to work to live because landlords/real estate speculator aren't going to let all of those money slosh around freely - they want theirs too.

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