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Australia to ban engineered stone

abc.net.au

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Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#21

Post by ezzaf »

legitster wrote: post #18

> Earlier this year workplace ministers tasked Safe Work Australia, a government WHS agency, with investigating how a ban could work and whether low-silica engineered stone could remain on the market safely. > The report found there was no safe level of silica, concluding: "The use of all engineered stone should be prohibited." I don't understand this logic. Silica is also present in natural stone too! If they are no…

Studies looking into the issue have found non silica compounds cause issues too, and its the engineering process rather than the silica that causes the problem. This is why they haven't created an exemption for low-silica products.

> "It's not just about the silica, it's something specific about the engineered stone products that's causing such a significant issue in workers fabricating these products."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-12-05/study-finds-safety-co...

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#22

Post by neilv »

Freedom2 wrote: post #5

I'm not a huge fan of government overreach like this. Workers should have refused to work with the material if it were truly dangerous, and the free market would have eventually pushed engineered stone out, giving way to innovation for a better, safer material.

Workers often don't have much choice, even if they knew the harm being done to them.

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#23

Post by jbjbjbjb »

Freedom2 wrote: post #5

I'm not a huge fan of government overreach like this. Workers should have refused to work with the material if it were truly dangerous, and the free market would have eventually pushed engineered stone out, giving way to innovation for a better, safer material.

Markets have market failures like externalities and information asymmetry

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#25

Post by jbjbjbjb »

gonzo41 wrote: post #19
Freedom2 wrote: post #5

I'm not a huge fan of government overreach like this. Workers should have refused to work with the material if it were truly dangerous, and the free market would have eventually pushed engineered stone out, giving way to innovation for a better, safer material.

Did you get raised reading only economic and game theory texts? Real people in the real world don't have as much agency as you'd like to think. Sometimes you take the job that you can get. See Amazon warehouse workers.

Obviously not, a trained economist would know about market failures.

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#26

Post by timeon »

Freedom2 wrote: post #5

I'm not a huge fan of government overreach like this. Workers should have refused to work with the material if it were truly dangerous, and the free market would have eventually pushed engineered stone out, giving way to innovation for a better, safer material.

Is this satire?

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#27

Post by insaneirish »

archontes wrote: post #20
umvi wrote: post #17

Seems like you should ban the manufacturing methods, not the end product. Like, if I invent a way to safely manufacture and do on-site adjustments of engineered stone, shouldn't I be rewarded by the market for it? The material itself is not harmful, just breathing the dust of it is, which can be said of a lot of things in a common household.

Do you think that folks will install it on site without cutting it?

As far as countertops go, field cuts are rather uncommon. Laser templating works well.

Holes on the other hand tend to be done in the field. But, people don't wear PPE even though it's simple and easy to do.

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#29

Post by saxman0001 »

insaneirish wrote: post #16
saxman001 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wearing PPE is miserable. The respiratory masks that reliably keep silica out of your lungs are painful. My job involves working with silica powders and I can really only handle about 20-30 minutes decked out in my bunny suit, respirator, over eye goggles, gloves and disposable sleeves before I need to take a break for air. This is in a climate controlled environment with a minimally physical set of tasks. Having wor…

> Wearing PPE is miserable. The respiratory masks that reliably keep silica out of your lungs are painful. I completely disagree. Is it less comfortable than not wearing a mask? For sure. Do I consider it a burden to wear a P100 respirator when dealing with silica? Nope.

How many hours a day do you typically spend wearing your respirator?

Have you had a professional fit test to see whether your respirator is making an adequate seal? Many folks wear these things far too loosely to pass a basic fitment test.

How many hours a day do you spend moving objects that weight >20lbs while wearing your respirator?

How often do you work on days >30C while decked out in your respirator?

Do you keep your face shaved baby smooth at all times?

Re: Australia to ban engineered stone

#30

Post by umvi »

threeseed wrote: post #7
Freedom2 wrote: post #5

I'm not a huge fan of government overreach like this. Workers should have refused to work with the material if it were truly dangerous, and the free market would have eventually pushed engineered stone out, giving way to innovation for a better, safer material.

a) It is truly dangerous. On par with asbestos. b) At least here in Australia the government any by extension taxpayers will have an increased health care burden because of this. Therefore it is entirely justified to limit its use.

My understanding is that a countertop won't release silica dust unless you cut it with power tools, unlike exposed asbestos which releases fibers with much less effort.
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