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Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

nytimes.com

331–340 of 362 posts

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not. It was the reduction of hiring standards that is a problem.

Well, in your comment that I was replying to, you were complaining about diversity.

I was complaining about them caring about diversity so much that they drastically reduced the hiring standards so they could fill ATC with diverse candidates quickly.

Also, I think it's racist and discriminatory towards young white people.

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#332
post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Traffic fatalities decrease because cars are getting safer. But the number or accidents per capita might not be. Pedestrian deaths have certainly been on the rise. https://www.ghsa.org/sites/default/files/publications/files/...

People are driving spaceship-sized SUVs while using their phones, hitting pedestrians who are walking around looking at their phones, jumping out of the path of an oncoming 12yo doing 40kmh on a battery powered scooter while looking at porn on their phones and using Whatsapp to schedule a meet up with their Fastgas supplier. Their parents think that a scooter is a toy, the phone is so that they can call home, and the…

To be fair, the responsibility to not-kill lies squarely at the hands of SUV drivers.

SUV -> human/scooter collision is the only one that leads to fatalities.

Also remember, we have infrastructure for cars, but very little for pedestrians or cyclists. Cyclists don't want to be on the road. They're much rather be on grade-separated bike paths. I don't endorse cyclists on footpaths, but in a lot of cities it is legal if the road not have adequate bike infrastructure.

Similarly, if pedestrians are walking on a green, they should be able to be on their phones. I do not endorse that behavior, but it is not like they are responsible for coming under death machine driven by another driver.

Your comment appears to distribute the blame across all 3 people. But 1 of these is 2 orders of magnitude more to blame than the other 2.

_____

I do agree that any going at car speed (Motorized scooters, Lycra-clad racers) belong where cars are: the road. A helmet can only do so much if you face plant at 50 kmph. Anything that can go above 30 kmph on a flat, belongs on a road.

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#333
post #245
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you didn’t think there was some validity to the reporting, you wouldn’t be posting it.

To stimulate discussion perhaps? Because it is a related topic (regardless of whether or not there is direct correlation). Hiring people based on skin color rather than skills is a problem, esp. with industries where lives are at stake.

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Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I make no claim about the accuracy of the reporting below Then you appear to knowingly spreading unfounded rumors?

Perhaps, but I did review the material before I posted it. Did you?

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Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#335
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This might be the worst real example of a jump to conclusions based on a casual correlation I have seen in my entire life. I don't even know how to properly deconstruct how irresponsible this style of thinking is, it's just so flabbergasting. In science you can't just draw lines on the wall between random shit like you're Charlie Day in It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. ACT scores are very obviously not a product of…

> potentially concerning > This might be the worst real example of a jump to conclusions based on a casual correlation I have seen in my entire life. I don't even know how to properly deconstruct how irresponsible this style of thinking is, it's just so flabbergasting. Exactly who is jumping to conclusions in this exchange? I used the words "potentially concerning" because that is what I thought and intended to expre…

I read your comment carefully. I think it projects more confidence in the theory than you might realize.

The word “potentially” is the lone word that makes any attempt to pump the brakes.

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#336
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding this thread, I really want to caution on the desire to automatically assign worse car crash rates to covid-19 infections, or any other specific cause. Car crashes and ATC mistakes are two different sets of data. Just because they are going up or down at the same time and you can overlay some other event on top of it means absolutely nothing on its own. There are a lot more reasons that car crash rates can b…

> Regarding this thread, I really want to caution on the desire to automatically assign worse car crash rates to covid-19 infections, or any other specific cause. People’s tolerance levels and general concern for other humans plummeted in the post covid times. The warning signs about acceptable behaviour in supermarkets, medical practices and restaurants proliferated. I don’t know how you measure that effect though.

I don’t know what grocery stores or restaurants you go to but I don’t see this supposed lack of concern for others that you’re talking about. It seems the same to me.

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#337

I've been warning of software deterioration for the past few years and this seems to be an extension of the same effect. Likely the result of increasingly non-meritocratic employee selection processes and non-meritocratic incentive structures. Due to government interference in the economy (especially due to money printing), we've basically turned our capitalist system into a very poorly implemented communist system.…

You just have depression. Healthy people don't go around collecting sad half-truths. I don't know any rich people with 10 girlfriends though. Rich people have just as much time as anyone else, likely even less since they usually work more, so that sounds hard to schedule.

As if anyone would tell you if they had 10 girlfriends on Tinder. The number is just a figure of speech. The effect is real.

Also, I'm probably happier than you will ever be because I live in the truth and am surrounded by honest people who have 0 incentive to pretend or say anything that they don't fully believe.

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just have depression. Healthy people don't go around collecting sad half-truths. I don't know any rich people with 10 girlfriends though. Rich people have just as much time as anyone else, likely even less since they usually work more, so that sounds hard to schedule.

As if anyone would tell you if they had 10 girlfriends on Tinder. The number is just a figure of speech. The effect is real. Also, I'm probably happier than you will ever be because I live in the truth and am surrounded by honest people who have 0 incentive to pretend or say anything that they don't fully believe.

Your truth is that people are broke[0] because there's too much money[1] and that you don't have a girlfriend because rich people on Tinder stole the women?

[0] they aren't https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/DSPIC96

[1] even if that made sense, it's going down again https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M2SL

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

50% of accidents are single vehicle accidents that involve drugs or alcohol. It's more if you add in youth an inexperience. So, _most_ vehicle deaths are self-inflicted. 16% are pedestrians. They usually get hit from behind, and even if they don't, almost always at night. 16% are motorcycles. I ride. I love riding, but the reason for that statistic is obvious. There's zero safety margin when you're on one. Finally, t…

Wat?! You can compare them. Ok if you are being pedantic you need to compare the airline, route, plane model and weather characteristic's with an equivalent car journey route, car model, mechanical condition and driver experience and mental fortitude. But in general planes are way safer than cars. If you are 40, perfect vision, sober as a saint in a modern safe car and drive mostly on highways at safe speeds you are…

    Ok if you are being pedantic you need to compare the airline, route, plane model and weather characteristic's with an equivalent car journey route, car model, mechanical condition and driver experience and mental fortitude.
You can’t compare a plane journey with a car journey; they’re not interchangeable. Most miles for people are just to and from work - planes can’t just replace all those journeys, even if you sum them up to some ridiculously large number.

If that’s wrong, then explain which pilot + aircraft combo you think is equivalent to the “typical” suburban car journey.

Re: Air traffic controllers pushed to the brink

#340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've only been in a car with two people who claim to get a lot of false positives on their AEB system while driving. Every time I saw a "false positive" it was almost always because they were driving very unsafely, trying to weave through heavy traffic at high speeds, approaching cars extremely rapidly and attempting to leave no room. In other words, not really false just not what the highly unsafe driver was wanting…

Nah my feet work and so do my eyes. I have had small accidents in the past and learned from them. I understand for people who don't learn or can't judge speed and need a crutch, but perhaps it's better they don't drive at all.

> I have had small accidents in the past and learned from them.

Maybe if you had AEB and FCW you wouldn't have had those accidents in the first place. Or did you not have working feet and eyes at the time and only recently got those installed? You even acknowledged you've had multiple collisions, did you not learn when getting your license? Did you not learn on the first accident? How many collisions should be expected for people to learn?

I'll be more clear. If your AEB is engaging while driving on the roads, you're probably driving unsafely. If you're worried about your AEB triggering often, you should probably adjust your driving because it's probably pretty unsafe.

I'll grant there's probably a few models with twitchy AEB systems, but almost every overly sensitive AEB I've ever heard about is either a Tesla with phantom braking or overly sensitive in tight parking conditions, which once again shouldn't really be a safety problem as that should be low speed. And even then those are really only a few older models, anything made in the last several years seems pretty solid to me from the several cars I've driven with it.

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