Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#371

Post by runnerup » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:40 AM UTC

russelg wrote: post #336

Where is the hacker spirit here? The number of Apple apologists that have crawled out to say "see? I told you so!!" is saddening. It is a bit dicey when you're charging for it, but since Mini was entirely client-side it would be feasible for a free version to exist. Apple claims iMessage is E2EE, do we have proof they aren't siphoning the messages from the client once it's been decrypted? The level of trust we have t…

I remember another post that was very well-received where an individual hacker wrote his own homebrew iMessage client for his own personal purposes. HN really liked that!

I think HN exists at an intersection of individual hackerism and business. If a project is clearly by-hackers-for-hackers it gets a lot more leeway for unsustainable concepts / implementations. But this is building a business on adversarial interoperability, and many people who LOVE the concept and technical achievements will still post mostly critical things about the business model because it’s fairly clearly a very very challenging business model.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#372

Post by cqqxo4zV46cp » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:40 AM UTC

jgaxn wrote: post #184

StressedDev wrote: post #143

One thing which is really confusing is why are Android users obsessed with iMessage? Android users can send text messages to iPhones, the can call iPhone users, and they can use third party messaging apps to communicate with iPhone users. It really isn’t clear to me why so many people are so angry they cannot use iMessage on Android.

The iPhone user experience for messaging with Android users (especially MMS) is awful and the Android users in the group chat get blamed for it. Having blue text bubbles show up when someone texts you can be seen in some circles as a status symbol.

Let’s be clear here: Apple not yet implementing RCS aside, the experience is horrible because SMS/MMS are horrible.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#373

Post by KerrAvon » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:40 AM UTC

ysofunny wrote: post #319

CharlesW wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep in mind that this is spin — Erik's statement is ridiculous, and he knows it. To think that Apple would somehow not treat Beeper like any other bad actor hacking iMessage protocols is delulu.

but the real problem some of use have with Apple's behavior is the real underlying reasons they're doing this I am reasonably sure that their main driver is profit which really means exploitation of people; I consider their public arguments lies made up to cover up the fact that what they account for as profit comes from what are in the end some really ugly historical and traditional imperialistic (colonial, neocolon…

> I am reasonably sure that their main driver is profit which really means exploitation of people;

What phone do you use that does not have the same issue?

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#374

Post by wildrhythms » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:41 AM UTC

KomoD wrote: post #52

This is what Snazzy Labs said about Beeper Mini... hilarious: > This doesn't appear to be some easy thing Apple can just turn off. > It will require a complete redesign of their entire authentication and delivery strategy for not just iMessage but Apple ID account access as a whole.

The bar for 'tech journalist' is... none. There is no bar.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#375

Post by thomastjeffery » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:41 AM UTC

madeofpalk wrote: post #40

wmf wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One may wonder if the real goal was to create an antitrust case rather than a working app.

How is this a demonstration of "antitrust"? Apple does not unfairly prevent competition for messaging apps, as evidenced by a plethora of competition for messaging apps, plenty of which are far more popular on iPhone outside of the US. Apple faces the heat of this competition - it frequently adds features to iMessage to make it equal or better than it's competition. Voice notes through iMessage was a direct reaction…

The only reason that an alternative iMessage client is newsworthy at all is because Apple uses iMessage as a moat to keep people using Apple devices.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#376

Post by FridgeSeal » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:42 AM UTC

Is anyone genuinely surprised by this?

My mate and I had a bet on how long this would take (since the thread the other day), my guess of “3 weeks tops” was far too generous.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#377

Post by pilsetnieks » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:42 AM UTC

russelg wrote: post #336

Where is the hacker spirit here? The number of Apple apologists that have crawled out to say "see? I told you so!!" is saddening. It is a bit dicey when you're charging for it, but since Mini was entirely client-side it would be feasible for a free version to exist. Apple claims iMessage is E2EE, do we have proof they aren't siphoning the messages from the client once it's been decrypted? The level of trust we have t…

The troll toll?

> Just putting the thought out there.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Just_asking_questions

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#378

Post by pilsetnieks » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:44 AM UTC

runnerup wrote: post #371

russelg wrote: post #336

Where is the hacker spirit here? The number of Apple apologists that have crawled out to say "see? I told you so!!" is saddening. It is a bit dicey when you're charging for it, but since Mini was entirely client-side it would be feasible for a free version to exist. Apple claims iMessage is E2EE, do we have proof they aren't siphoning the messages from the client once it's been decrypted? The level of trust we have t…

I remember another post that was very well-received where an individual hacker wrote his own homebrew iMessage client for his own personal purposes. HN really liked that! I think HN exists at an intersection of individual hackerism and business. If a project is clearly by-hackers-for-hackers it gets a lot more leeway for unsustainable concepts / implementations. But this is building a business on adversarial interope…

You're allowed to admire the technical implementation while denouncing the business model at the same time.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#379

Post by cqqxo4zV46cp » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:44 AM UTC

LordDragonfang wrote: post #204

MBCook wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple announced RCS support. That will provide what you want.

Right, but that's likely not coming out for another year yet, and requires everyone involved to update their phones (yet another hassle for non-technical users, they will put updates off for as long as they can). As the quote in the article says, Apple clearly recognizes the issue, and beeper mini fixes it now , not "at some point in the future".

Getting someone to update their iPhone is a matter of them not actively dismissing iOS’s repeated attempts at updating itself. This isn’t a good-faith argument.

Re: Apple cuts off Beeper Mini's access

#380

Post by justin_oaks » Sat, Dec 09, 2023, 12:45 AM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #224

The security argument is all very well, but I don't care for iMessage distinction between iP* users and Android/others. It reminds me of Jane Elliot's experiments*. Reinforcing your brand identity by structuring the private conversations of your users is weird and somewhat creepy. * https://ca.pbslearningmedia.org/resource/osi04.soc.ush.civil...

Thanks for sharing the link about Jane Elliot's classroom lessons. I only learned about this today.