Euro folks here: Oh, this thing again.
Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
881–890 of 902 posts
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#882Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm from Europe and live in Hong Kong, in both places, iMessage to us is like Edge for Windows users: a gimmick we see auto-installed but we dont use. So many people don't have an iPhone, and we change phone number every few months anyway. The US experience might be diff, and Europe / Asia aren't a single country, so maybe it even varies within.
> I'm from Europe > in both places > so maybe it even varies within. Definitely Europe is not as homogenous as that. I do also live in Europe, people do use iMessage (or just text messages in general) where I am (to a much smaller extent than the FB messenger for instance which is much bigger than WhatsApp here). And any meaningful number of people changing their phone number every few months is certainly not my expe…
Yeah I used it because the original comment did: ofc Europe is not a real homogeneous place.
I'm from Normandy to be hyper precise, and there, we don't have much iPhones or use iMessage. I certainly never heard of isolation due to lack of iMessage: we use sms or whatsapp.
In Hong Kong, it's common, maybe only among immigrants like me, to change number often, it just is, everyone I know does it, we just migrate with whatsapp. We do it to reduce the spam explosion over time as we give our numbers to more and more people, or to switch to cheaper 5G plans over time or stuff like that. I certainly hate now keeping a phone number too long, it just feels unsafe.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#883This brings back the days of trillian (the best multi-chat client for the desktop in the age of ICQ, AIM, MSN) that got killed by the raise of mobile phones and mobile chat apps.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#884Earlier quoted context omitted.
We had universal chat applications & standards and interoperability in the 2000s. Pidgin (et al.) + libpurple allowed users to use a singular application for chat--even the proprietary protocols. We also had (& still have) XMPP from that era which many of the big boys like Google jumped on, killed, then jumped off (EEE?). Are we just repeating history ( https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-netwo...…
Given how many large chat systems are based on XMPP, it should be possible to select a set of standard extensions to interoperate with each other. Sadly, I don't see it happening.
True. But developers should push in that direction anyhow since it still means interop for those in that camp already… and considering how well those large systems have scaled, it’s a good idea.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#885Earlier quoted context omitted.
We had universal chat applications & standards and interoperability in the 2000s. Pidgin (et al.) + libpurple allowed users to use a singular application for chat--even the proprietary protocols. We also had (& still have) XMPP from that era which many of the big boys like Google jumped on, killed, then jumped off (EEE?). Are we just repeating history ( https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-netwo...…
This was never enough for me. On paper Pidgin did the trick, but you still had to remember which of your friends preferred which platform, you had multiple "friend" entries for the same person, many used silly pseudonyms that they certainly didn't go by IRL, you had no way to tell if your friends actually were monitoring each of their accounts (I uninstalled aim months ago, have you been sending me messages on it?),…
Since those services all died off my memory is a bit foggy, but I recall stacking contacts in one with Adium & being able to prioritize in that meta contact which service they provided. But I really only ever used it for two-person conversations so I had no experience with the group situation. Even still, a multi-chat app was a vastly better user experience than running several independent applications (with the cost of missing ‘advanced’ features & occasional outages as protocols needed to be reverse engineered & the proprietary providers had no incentive for backwards compatibility).
> Google particularly abandoned it for really no reason
What most annoying is seeing Big Tech now trying to write a new standard to comply with the EU instead of using the existing standard they abandoned that already has all the mileage & scaling looked at. Instead all the same hurdles will have to be overcome yet again, just like the current growing pains of Matrix meanwhile XMPP is still quietly holding strong for massive chat/presence systems.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#886Earlier quoted context omitted.
But EU interoperability laws are cancelled out by DMCA (aka EUCD). That’s why reading a DVD with VLC has always been “technically” illegal. If Apple is able to update the protocol in such a way that it requires some kind of signed attestation from the secure enclave (basically a DRM) they’ll get legal protection. Also. Nobody uses iMessage in the EU. It’s all WhatsApp here. Blue bubbles are an American obsession.
The recently enacted DMA requires interoperability. Unless Apple wins its case against iMessage being classified as a gatekeeper service, it'll be required to support interoperability. I'd be surprised if tricks like hardware attestation were compliant, unless Apple allowed other companies' hardware.
However, iMessage (the software) is already interoperable with SMS and MMS.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#887Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Section 1201 provides for felony liability for anyone commercially engaged in bypassing a DRM system: 5 years in prison and a $500,000 fine for a first offense." So it's even worse than the risk of being taken down. Way worse. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2017/10/drms-dead-canary-how-w...
iMessage is not DRM. It is not protecting IP.
ROFL..
Yeah, and when exactly should everyone expect to stop seeing DMCA take down notices that didn't abuse the system, willingful harm creators, and an appeals process that is an unfunny joke?
Until then, it doesn't matter what the law says. They will abuse it, because PROFITS.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#888Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#889Earlier quoted context omitted.
This was never enough for me. On paper Pidgin did the trick, but you still had to remember which of your friends preferred which platform, you had multiple "friend" entries for the same person, many used silly pseudonyms that they certainly didn't go by IRL, you had no way to tell if your friends actually were monitoring each of their accounts (I uninstalled aim months ago, have you been sending me messages on it?),…
Since those services all died off my memory is a bit foggy, but I recall stacking contacts in one with Adium & being able to prioritize in that meta contact which service they provided. But I really only ever used it for two-person conversations so I had no experience with the group situation. Even still, a multi-chat app was a vastly better user experience than running several independent applications (with the cost…
I agree that it's better than using multiple applications, but today I just use one (for personal conversations at least, Slack for business and Discord for communities is a bit different), which is texting.
Re: Show HN: Beeper Mini – iMessage client for Android
#890Wanted to try it, but for some reason it requires a google account. I don't have one.