Live data from Hacker News

An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

pythonafrica.blogspot.com

41–50 of 423 posts

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#41

> What counts as “safety”? Which places in the world are truly safe for LGBTQIA+ community? How much of a city, or state, or country needs to be LGBTQIA+ hostile for the whole of it to be declared unworthy of PSF support? What a cheap shot. You don't need a safetyometer or something to determine that a country where same sex relationship is punishable by life imprisonment is unsafe for homosexuals or bisexuals.

The claims of Zanzibar being unsafe for LGBTQIA+ communities is ridiculous. I live there and it's the most tolerant place I lived in so far. There are laws, but as long as you mind your own business and don't disturb others, you will be left alone. I've even been to same-sex weddings here (between foreigners of course, same-sex relationships are still taboo between locals but they do exist) and have gay friends living on the island that never reported any incident (unlike in Europe).

Still, there are some things that should be avoided in public, out of respect for the local population. Kissing and holding hands for example is not well seen, even for heterosexual couples. Despite this, even if you happen to do it in public you will never face verbal or physical aggression from anyone, maybe just some frowns but even that is rare.

Pushing our views to countries that are still developing is Neocolonialism at its best. We take our progress in the West for granted, but it took us time to get there. Give the tools for Africans country to develop on their own, they will get there in their own time, there are many other pressing matters to address first.

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#42
post #20

> We know that there are some extraordinary attitudes at work within the PSF. A PSF Board member once openly expressed the opinion that Anglo cultures always seem to be the ones that take the moral lead around the world, leaving others to follow their example. From any non-western perspective, this is an astounding idea to receive. > That’s not a solitary episode. We understand that (notwithstanding the PSF’s ambitio…

PSF would gain a lot from getting acquainted with Kipling's The White Man's Burden.

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#43
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Would they come after you if you brought your same sex partner? If you had a rainbow pin? Does it really matter where the exact limit goes? Would you feel safe being in a country where your sexuality was illegal? No way I would take that chance for a python conference.

[flagged]

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is an effective safe space other than saying "relax, generally nothing happens"? Are you guaranteeing their safety? Of course not. I live in a "less than enlightened" country and I do know when everything feels safe tiny little things can lead to catastrophic consequences. I experience it regularly. Effective means nothing.

>tiny little things can lead to catastrophic consequences Do you mean things that are against the law?

Things that are against the law or things powerful people don't like. Law is just a tool for them.

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#45
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't need LGBT hunt squads. All you need is the fact that a gay couple holding hands or kissing publicly is unsafe. "Then just don't kiss publicly". Sure, hiding one's sexuality isn't that hard, especially for a short period of time. But that's the whole problem: they shouldn't have to hide it in the first place. Home people might know you, but in home country you are against only bigoted individuals, not the en…

>But that's the whole problem: they shouldn't have to hide it in the first place. What does that have to do with Python? You can chose to respect the laws in the country you are in, or not.

You can also judge if a given law is moral or valid, and take actions based on that.

PSF has some moral views and they believe in some standards regardless of given country's law. Why are you so fixated on that?

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#46
post #28
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point was not properly made on their behalf. That said, do the organizers of the conference have any saying on the politics on their country and actually deserve to be punished because of them? I don't really think so.

That's literally how any 'anti-state' action works, ever. Does an individual Russian have a say in what Putin does in Ukraine? Probably not. But countries are a collection of its citizens. The only way to 'punish' a country is to punish its citizens. Sometimes it's more direct, other times less. But at the end of the day, any and all actions will trickle down to punishing individuals, because that's simply how action…

[flagged]

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#47
post #27

> What counts as “safety”? Which places in the world are truly safe for LGBTQIA+ community? How much of a city, or state, or country needs to be LGBTQIA+ hostile for the whole of it to be declared unworthy of PSF support? What a cheap shot. You don't need a safetyometer or something to determine that a country where same sex relationship is punishable by life imprisonment is unsafe for homosexuals or bisexuals.

Do it virtually if safety is an issue. Just like with covid.

[flagged]

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#49

Why do “open letters” get so much more respect and attention than an ordinary whining email? The headline “A whining email to ” would be ignored. Change it to “open letter” and it’s instant gravitas. Seems to be the same sort of magic words as ”considered harmful”……. instantly credible and worthy of consideration. I really should frame all of my grumbles about the state of the world as “open letters” so people pay at…

That is confirmation bias. You only know of the successful open letters and are ignoring all the ones which were not.

Search this very website for the term and sort by popularity, then start from the last page. See how many you ever even knew existed.

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&prefix=false&query=ope...

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the same time, software should not be tied to politics. People should be able to hold different political views while taking part in software conferences.

That’s a naive statement. People die in large numbers because of horrible governments. Software conferences should be restricted because of politics.

Political pluralism should be the default. When an "us vs them" mentality is embedded in every aspect of society, those are the conditions that lead to horrible governments arising. It becomes more about protecting/promoting the "us" and screwing over the "them" than running a functional fair government.
Post reply on HN