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RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

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Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#151

Post by n9 »

hedora wrote: post #88
WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #41

Meh macOS is more than shiny traffic lights buttons on your windows, global menus, and dock. It's also a clipboard that works everywhere and not like "oh you cannot do this because X11 this or wayland that", it's also human interface guidelines (the old ones, the new ones are unparseable shit) that make bloody sure that the OK/Cancel buttons appear where you expect them to appear. It's also some bloody keyboard short…

You are describing MacOS 9. The ribbon had all the settings for the OS, and was always a click away. Finder worked out of the box. These days, copy-paste is hit or miss, and the window manager can’t be reliably controlled via the keyboard. Also, even in first party apps, keyboard shortcuts are completely inconsistent. Command-0 no longer reliably restores the main window. In maps, Command-L doesn’t focus the location…

sure, there are inconsistencies, but with some global shortcuts in your muscle memory and a few years of using spotlight under your belt... OSX out of the box is fast and efficient as hell.

But I will relent and acknowledge that your arguments ring very true. How do I get my Messages window back if I accentally close it? Very good point.

The ribbon though? I think your memory is optimistic. It was in my memory ugly, clunky, slow and had some, but few system settings. But I must admit that in my heart OS 7.1 was the high water mark of usability and I resented all subsequent innovations... which it sounds like you might be able to empathize with.

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#152

Post by n9 »

hospitalJail wrote: post #47
WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #41

Meh macOS is more than shiny traffic lights buttons on your windows, global menus, and dock. It's also a clipboard that works everywhere and not like "oh you cannot do this because X11 this or wayland that", it's also human interface guidelines (the old ones, the new ones are unparseable shit) that make bloody sure that the OK/Cancel buttons appear where you expect them to appear. It's also some bloody keyboard short…

> Try blindfolding yourself, inserting your installer usb stick, and installing your thing and using it successfully. I don't understand this. Are you saying its hard to install Linux? Has this ever been true? Usually you smash the Next button. There is a partioning screen, but that is some serious changes you are going to make. I don't care what OS religion you follow, I'm taking the blindfold off during partioning.

they are saying that you can literally install the OS start to finish it (and configure it for sightless use to boot) without being able to see at all. As in blind. This was part of the point they were making about accesibility features and UI consistency in MacOS.

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#153

Post by gspencley »

hnlmorg wrote: post #24

Maybe this is just me but I never considered Apples approach to software installs to be elegant. And I’m not a fan of their unified menu bar (or most aspected of their desktop environment for that matter). What I’d love to see would be a whole new desktop environment for macOS (homebrew has its warts but is a “good enough” package manager for my day to day needs)

I was forced to use a Mac for work and almost resigned because of it. I happily concede that a lot of it is what you are used to, but to me I need to be able to configure all aspects of my UI / DE ... including things like universal font sizes (which was my biggest issue due to my eyesight and finding that their fonts gave me headaches on my external monitor).

For people who are not "power users" then I suppose I can see the appeal. But the "it's our way or use something else" philosophy doesn't work for me. I will use something else (the problem is when you're forced into a system with that mindset). The computer is a tool, I am the master of the machine (especially as a programmer), and I can't stand feeling like there are barriers between me and how I want the system to behave. "Finesse" to me is the ability to install a completely different desktop environment if I so choose. To type "rm -rf /" as root and not have the machine question my command (very dangerous for the non power users I admit).

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#154

Post by tcmart14 »

bjelkeman-again wrote: post #96
henriquez wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It appears like they’ve aped some of MacOS design language, but it’s clear they’re engineers, not designers. There’s enough “uncanny valley” between this OS and actual modern Apple UI design that it comes off a bit like all those versions of KDE that tried to look and act exactly like Windows XP and always felt a bit “off.” Their screenshots page is a Frankenstein mess of poor font quality and Apple themes mixed toge…

Apple’s UI design certainly has flaws. I really don’t understand why they changed the way the System Settings in Ventura/Sonoma(?) now looks like and behaves more like iOS, as an example. However, as someone who has used GUIs from SunView/Irix Desktop/DECwindows to iPadOS/MacOS, via Windows 2.0/3.0/95/NT/etc. I am of the opinion that Apple is still the most consistent and easy to learn GUI. Even my 80-year old mother…

To me that is kind of the key strength and why Apple has such a good UI story. Its not necessarily that they perfected the UI. There are certainly parts I dislike. But, its consistent. I have to use Windows 11 at work. It is amazing how some windows have been brought up to date with the new design language of Windows 11, but I open up the Windows Event viewer and still has like the Windows 7 design language.

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#155

Post by cristeigabriel »

LeFantome wrote: post #144
cristeigabriel wrote: post #100

It just looks bad. You want to be MacOS? Actually go and copy it, as close to pixel perfect as you fancy. I've personally experimented with replicating UIs using just a "device" object to a graphical API, so I know very well that it is possible. What prevents this project from just... going out and actually doing what they're trying to achieve? Take high resolution screenshots, carefully understand what's going on, a…

At the pace they are going, they are years from a usable system. The screenshots you are looking at are from an abandoned approach to doing the GUI tech. The level of polish that you are advocating seems completely premature to the current level of development. This is not just a visual design shell. They are proposing a macOS mimic much more deeply at the OS level.

To advertise "finesse of macOS", you should deliver on that

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#156

Post by Xerox9213 »

n9 wrote: post #150
hospitalJail wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really goes to show the demand of exclusive MacOS software. To be fair, if something is on Mac, it is usually on Linux. Windows is a bit different.

Also... Preview is not available on any other platform and is, imo, the single best executed application of all time.

Absolutely. It's the only PDF editor that holds a candle to Acrobat Pro.

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#158

Post by Klonoar »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #62

Abandonware? Last release was June 2022.

I suspect most people in this thread haven’t gone deeper than the website.

The project creator is actually very capable - what they’ve done so far is very impressive on a technical level. The project has an effective bus factor of 1, though: I’ve lurked in the Discord for the past year (since it was called Airyx) or so and plenty of people come in but don’t contribute much.

Unless that changes I’m not sure it’ll work out long term.

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#159

Post by frankhhhhhhhhh »

tiltowait wrote: post #108
cristeigabriel wrote: post #100

It just looks bad. You want to be MacOS? Actually go and copy it, as close to pixel perfect as you fancy. I've personally experimented with replicating UIs using just a "device" object to a graphical API, so I know very well that it is possible. What prevents this project from just... going out and actually doing what they're trying to achieve? Take high resolution screenshots, carefully understand what's going on, a…

This screenshot[1] is a great example of what you're talking about. * Awful typography (especially bold text) * Ugly gray background in foreground window * Windows 95-era buttons in the foreground window * Weird left padding in the (ugly) dock * Terminal window has window controls on the right for some reason, and they look like they're from Windows? All that said, it's still in preview (v0.4pre4), and these things c…

This desktop is just screaming for some drop shadows.

Re: RavynOS Finesse of macOS. Freedom of FreeBSD

#160

Post by [deleted] »

steve1977 wrote: post #73
creatonez wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What should WIP software look like? There was a time when the 1998 beta for macOS, called Rhapsody, looked horrible and disjoint. There was also a time when the iPhone looked like this - https://i.imgur.com/wwH2UoF.jpg

Rhapsody looked pretty decent IMHO… http://toastytech.com/guis/rhap.html

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