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The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

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Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#91

Post by kortilla »

knallfrosch wrote: post #42
locallost wrote: post #29

Everything's possible, but there would be no debate about UI mistakes if it was Iran shooting down a US plane. They would've done because they are evil by nature, or at least perceived as such. In that case the media and the public buys into its own reality, but of course the UI discussion could be a distraction from the public maybe starting to question if that's actually the reality. Also from the Wiki page about t…

It's not really a UX error when your helicopter-carrier invades Iran after one of your helicopters invaded Iran. In wartime. What were these warships even doing in the PERSIAN gulf? And why do they shoot Iranian airplanes in Iranian airspace while they themselves are in Iran? I image "UX error" wouldn't cut it if a chinese missile cruiser shot down an US airliner while steaming up the Hudson.

They were in wartime, you answered your own question.

>I image "UX error" wouldn't cut it if a chinese missile cruiser shot down an US airliner while steaming up the Hudson.

Yes, that would be up for debate if the US were in an active war with China.

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#92

Post by gpderetta »

dsego wrote: post #64
raverbashing wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the Soviets had visual confirmation of the target Vincennes did not (which to be fair should have done - and not excusing their actions here)

That's a good point, why didn't they seek visual confirmation first?

Another US ship was attacked by Iraqi Exocet missiles beyond visual range on the same region just one year before. US had also attacked Iran assets in the year before after one US ship was damaged by Iranian mines. Tensions were very high.

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#93

Post by lgrapenthin »

xkbarkar wrote: post #87

What a terrible platform to present an interesting story. What wrong with a good old fashioned article style blog ? I admit I am so turned off by the format I only made it hlf way throught the thread.

I gave up when I realized that I have to click on each "tweet" to read more

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#94

Post by m463 »

I wonder when a tesla will show up in a courtroom with a situation like this.

I'm not talking about autopilot.

I'm talking about the continuous (past ridiculous) removal of physical controls from their vehicles.

For example, the original model S/X had dedicated controls for lots of functions - turn signals, gear shift, wipers, autopilot, steering wheel tilt, etc. On the steering wheel, there were two buttons and a scrollwheel on each side of the steering wheel. Press the center of the steering wheel for the horn. The door had mirror adjustment and windows + lock

Unfortunately a few critical controls were on the touchscreen - defrost front and back were big ones, but all the climate controls, and other nonsense too - all pretty much hidden with multiple taps, or small targets or both.

not all of this is bad - putting lots of detailed but non-critical settings like miles vs km are the perfect thing to have on a touchscreen.

but it needed more dedicated controls.

When the Model 3 came out, it started removing controls. There are two stalks, the turn signal also sort of controls headlights and wipers, the shifter is overloaded with autopilot. It has two scrollwheels without buttons, you have to push them left and right.

all other controls are on the touchscreen.

It really needs dedicated controls for important things.

And then the updated model S/X came out. wow.

there are NO stalks. turn signals are touch areas on the steering wheel. so are high beams, horn, wipers. the scroll wheels do different things at different times.

shifter? nope - it guesses what direction you want to go. many more things involve the touchscreen, like going into park. (there is also a touch drive selector in the center console, but you have to look down and touch it to wake, then to select)

Just a mess. It makes you a worse driver.

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#95

Post by gpderetta »

Aissen wrote: post #37

Pro-tip to those unused to mastodon web-ui: you can click the eye on the top right of the center column (next to Back) to expand all posts at once.

Maybe my expectations are very very low at this point. But I thought it was ok.

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#96

Post by subpixel »

xkbarkar wrote: post #87

What a terrible platform to present an interesting story. What wrong with a good old fashioned article style blog ? I admit I am so turned off by the format I only made it hlf way throught the thread.

User interface disaster indeed

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#97

Post by ponector »

cies wrote: post #52
tpm wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NATO bombing of serbian power stations was done in response of Serbian ethnic cleansing in Kosovo, after the horrible crimes against humanity perpetrated by serbian forces in Bosnia. "russians doing the same" is a blatant lie. What the russians are doing is a genocide.

Russia's invasion of Ukraine is pretty low on civ casualties. Look at Gaza, or the Iraq/Vietnam invasions compare numbers (civ casualties AND time it took) and then draw conclusions on the use of the word genocide. I also would abstain from using "russians" (or USAers, or Israelis) when referring to actions of the respective govts. Keeps the discussion cleaner of generalizations wrt people that may totally not suppor…

[flagged]

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#98

Post by grotorea »

Since we're on the topic, you know how much HN complains about touchscreens on cars? Now find out how replacing old school analog controls with software touchscreens UI partly led to the USS John S. McCain colliding: https://features.propublica.org/navy-uss-mccain-crash/navy-i...

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#99

Post by athesyn »

lgrapenthin wrote: post #93
xkbarkar wrote: post #87

What a terrible platform to present an interesting story. What wrong with a good old fashioned article style blog ? I admit I am so turned off by the format I only made it hlf way throught the thread.

I gave up when I realized that I have to click on each "tweet" to read more

the horror

Re: The 1988 shooting down of Flight 655 as a user interface disaster

#100

Post by mistermann »

da_chicken wrote: post #53
locallost wrote: post #29

Everything's possible, but there would be no debate about UI mistakes if it was Iran shooting down a US plane. They would've done because they are evil by nature, or at least perceived as such. In that case the media and the public buys into its own reality, but of course the UI discussion could be a distraction from the public maybe starting to question if that's actually the reality. Also from the Wiki page about t…

You can't really compare how a nation judges being a victim of it's own mistakes directly to how a nation would judge being a victim of its enemy's mistakes. Obviously there's going to be a whole lot more skepticism and distrust.

Which is not the same as whether it can be done at all, it's more so that accuracy and epistemic humility are currently low priorities for early 21st century humanity.
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