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Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

polygon.com

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Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#91

Post by noirscape »

low_tech_love wrote: post #71
noirscape wrote: post #19

SMRPG is great. It's absolutely "baby's first JRPG" (but with actual stats, not the low stats of Paper Mario) and it wears that badge with pride. I don't think there's a JRPG more accessible than this one if you're not familiar with the genre - the UI of the original is very much geared around "make it understandable to people who've only ever played the Mario platformers" and it just... works. From what I've seen, t…

Maybe it’s just nostalgia but neither paper Mario nor Mario & Luigi come a light year away from SMRPG for me. They feel just like bland superficial attempts at a formula when the formula is actually the least important part of SMRPG. The apparent weirdness that the reviewer mentioned is for me exactly why I love it: the characters just are what they are; you don’t have to understand, their unexplainable weirdness mak…

Paper Mario was initially fine IMO. It laserfocused into a very different niche; because it made stat logic simple math puzzles, the developers were able to build out the interactive element to SMRPGs fights into something that feels appropriate, yet not too obtrusive (something which the franchise would end up losing by the time Sticker Star came rolling around). A lot of attacks in SMRPG just have one button you press to make them stronger; by contrast Paper Mario would introduce things like stick flicking, holding moves or inserting certain button combinations to make them stronger.

Tonally I'd say 64, TTYD and Super manage to stick close enough to being "quirky, yet funny" with all of them having some emotional beats that they don't undercut. Sticker Star, Color Splash and Origami King all veer into self-parody levels when it comes to the writing and it just... sucks really. It's hard to take the entire thing seriously when everything you interact with makes a joke about how everything is made of paper every other sentence.

Mario & Luigi for the most part isn't really based on SMRPG. Most of it's DNA comes from a game called Tomato Adventure instead. That said, it did end up borrowing the more superficial RPG elements. Superstar Saga and Partners in Time probably fare the best in terms of mixing more RPG-like elements, while the games after would rapidly swing between "way too easy" and "absurdly difficult" when it came to the interactive component.

I'd say that last bit about game design only really started to fade away in... around the early-to-mid-2010s really. It was falling out of favor before that with Xbox and Playstation's approach to game design but the whole "everything is online now" means that games are trying to fight with their players against the inevitable deluge of other games out there.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#92

Post by mcphage »

echelon wrote: post #70
JoshTriplett wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Paper Mario series is commonly considered to be the successors of SMRPG: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paper_Mario That said, I'd love to see a sequel to SMRPG in a 3D style, rather than always using the "paper" style for RPGs.

The Paper Mario series and the Mario and Luigi series feel nothing like Super Mario RPG. They remove too many RPG elements and feel much more linear. They aren't packed with secrets, mythos, and a vivid primary and supporting cast. There's much less mystery and intrigue, very little to go back and unlock, and scant customization. Dealing with the disappointment of the new installments was one of the many things that…

> and scant customization

The badge system is phenomenally customizable. Different kinds of attacks, defenses, ways to play.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#93

Post by Trasmatta »

glhaynes wrote: post #87
Trasmatta wrote: post #9

SMRPG has an interesting place in my life. I got it when I was 12, and it sort of kickstarted my "online life". I started posting on the SMRPG GameFAQs message board, which was sort of my introduction to the internet. I made a lot of online friends there, some of whom I would stay up for hours and hours chatting with on AIM. One of those, I stayed friends with for about 15 years, until he disappeared one day. Sometim…

I enjoyed this, thanks for sharing. That's sad about the 15 year friend disappearing.

Thank you! I hope he's doing okay, wherever he is. He did this a few times, where he would disappear, then come back later with a new username, saying that he had to get away for awhile for emotional reasons. This time he never came back again, though. I have regrets, and feel like I wasn't a good friend to him near the end. I just hope he's happy.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#94

Post by Xeoncross »

djtango wrote: post #82
Xeoncross wrote: post #7

After Final Fantasy III/VI, Chrono Trigger, Secrets of Mana, Illusions of Gaia, Super Mario RPG, etc.. The golden age of RPG's was the release of the playstation. The combination of mechanics that had been refined into the richer world of cd quality audio, voice dialog, visual improvements to 3D worlds and CGI sequences. Final Fantasy VII, VIII, IX, Chrono Cross, Breath of Fire, Arc the Lad, Tales of Destiny, Grandia…

I grew up in this era so really try to keep my bias in check but that really did feel like the golden age of JRPGs and many other games at the time. Arguably certainly action games and shooters peaked later but late 90s Square was something else...

Yes, after the N64 and playstation (and Windows 3.1), the only thing that really revolutionized gaming was (working) online play.

Of course, graphics improve with each year, but hitting those first 3D consoles (and PC games) was amazing in a way that nothing else that follows has been. Hearing actual orchestral music or live acting in a game was fantastic.

Everyone remembers Mario 64 or the expansive open world Zelda: Ocarina of Time. In the same way, Final Fantasy 7 or 9 represent the best FF games to many people. Mario Kart is still the universal poster child for group games.

I'm glad things have continued to improve, but those first few consoles had growth of an industry so much more impactful than anything from the last 15 years (again, apart from good online play).

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#95

Post by chrisco255 »

munk-a wrote: post #81
chrisco255 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A multiplayer RPG was almost unheard of though until MMOs became a thing. Local multiplayer RPG was always quite rare. Interesting that Secret of Mana even attempted it.

Uh... except MUDs - which absolutely dominated the early era of gaming and still exist as a small but extremely dedicated player base to this day. Text will always be an extremely compelling medium for RPGs since you're only limited in your expression by your imagination - there is no graphical hindrance to what actions occur.

True, and I enjoyed a space based one that I used to play quite a bit back then, but I guess I would consider MUDs to be MMOs as well. They still ultimately required an internet connection and console games didn't really become popular for net based play until PS2.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#96

Post by debug-desperado »

swozey wrote: post #24
FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #22

It was good. The story and gameplay were good, and the art was excellent. But you know what game will really mess with your head? I mean, the art isn't as good, but it doesn't matter: Earthbound . (Also its predecessor, Mother . You can find translated ROMs.)

I loved SMRPG and I have tried to play Earthbound probably 50+ times in my 39 years of existence and I have never, ever found it fun or interesting. I don't think I've ever gotten past that opening where the village/city/whatever is under attack by aliens and you're running around trying to find people or something.

You're not alone, I also got stuck in that opening sequence as a child - thankfully the game was just a rental. Honestly at that stage in my life I didn't understand what was going on in the battle sequences since they were so text heavy. RPGs were too foreign of a concept at the time. Couple years later went on to enjoy the crap out of FF6, Chrono Trigger, and SMRPG, so I really should revisit Earthbound.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#97

Post by cableshaft »

pwython wrote: post #16

I somehow feel guilty for never even remembering the original game. My first console game was Mario Bros on the NES. And I was big into RPGs back in the late 90s (eg. FFVII). How am I just hearing of this now, and this remake?!

Dunno. I had the same start as you, and I owned a copy of the original SNES game that I bought shortly after it came out.

I was also reading gaming magazines and was already collecting pretty much every Squaresoft RPG at the time, though.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#99

Post by Dwedit »

aidenn0 wrote: post #76
tobiasSoftware wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" I don't think there's a JRPG more accessible than this one" I'd argue there's one more, though I may be biased as it's what got me into RPGs - Final Fantasy Mystic Quest. It's a relatively unknown title as it was an attempt by the Final Fantasy franchise to get beginners into RPGs. It's like Super Mario RPG in a lot of ways, including seeing monsters on the overworld. However, it's much more like table-top RPGs, wi…

Yeah, my friend and I got MQ when it first came out and beat it in a single day. IIRC, the resurrection item was cheaply available, instant-death to undead enemies, and healed living characters up to full health. There were some fun box-moving/jumping puzzles though.

There were no resurrection items in FFMQ. There is a Life spell for use during battles, and you automatically resurrect with 1HP after a battle.

Re: Super Mario RPG is an endearing, perplexing relic

#100

Post by nonethewiser »

thowaway91234 wrote: post #41
ocardoso wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So...Which Final Fantasy is Culex from?

None. He's original to Mario RPG. The allusion to Final Fantasy is just an easter egg.

I had absolutely no idea. I always saw him referred to as a final fantasy boss. I guess in mario rpg he's from that universe, but he's not actually from the universe. Crazy.
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