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KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

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Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#181

Post by michaelmrose »

tormeh wrote: post #139
beebeepka wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you don't have rtx, peasant! Seriously though, it's been a while since I've had serious issues with AMD cards on Linux. I was very annoyed with the state of my rx5700 when it first launched back in 2019. We've come a long way

> But you don't have rtx, peasant! [j/k] On Linux it's basically the opposite now. Nvidia should basically be seen as unsupported, which to be clear is 100% Nvidia's fault.

Its been well supported and functional for over 23 years through 17 years during which ati/amd gpus were closed source and bad then just bad.

X11 + Nvidia is still one the most common and functional configurations for people who want to use their computer instead of beta testing.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#182

Post by kaba0 »

brnt wrote: post #165
duckmysick wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the OP, but happens to me too. Steps to replicate: put your laptop to sleep (suspend) and try to wake it up (resume). You end up with a black screen. Often times, you can SSH into your laptop, but the screen remains unresponsive. Only hard reset helps. There are many reports of such bug. It's common on Wayland, but happens on X11 to some folks. The only constant is it happens on devices with Nvidia cards. I tried…

I didn't even have to do anything. Just boot after a fresh install and wait a minute or two. Three generation of all Intel laptops. I uploaded some logs, but people were utterly uninterested or hostile.

It has nothing to do with Wayland though, based on the description. Wayland used the base kernel API to manage the display. That is probably broken on your given device.

X11 often gets patched by a proprietary nvidia blob (the nvidia driver), which uses a separate, non-standard, X-specific API.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#183

Post by kaba0 »

flohofwoe wrote: post #111
sidkshatriya wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible some of these things are really distro+hw related, but for the sake of argument: > * Chrome needs a bunch of extra flags to launch in Wayland mode I'd rather have to worry about adding a few extra flags than worry about X11. X11 is overcomplicated, over-engineered, barely maintained, is apparently broken from a security angle, ancient... Till today I have found X11 configuration one of the toughest thin…

> Vulkan unlike OpenGL is also quite new. Vulkan is 7 years old by now. That's the same time span between Direct3D1 (1995) and Direct3D9 (2002). Wayland is 15 years old now btw. 7 and 15 years should be more than enough time to create stable and robust software libraries.

> 7 and 15 years should be more than enough time to create stable and robust software libraries

Yeah, if it were goddamn Apple forcing the ecosystem to make the change. Linux is the bazaar, no one forces anything, but it also comes with disadvantages, like not adapting new tech.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#184

Post by kaba0 »

wkat4242 wrote: post #175
sidkshatriya wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible some of these things are really distro+hw related, but for the sake of argument: > * Chrome needs a bunch of extra flags to launch in Wayland mode I'd rather have to worry about adding a few extra flags than worry about X11. X11 is overcomplicated, over-engineered, barely maintained, is apparently broken from a security angle, ancient... Till today I have found X11 configuration one of the toughest thin…

Of course X11 is badly maintained. Because RedHat took over the maintenance and they want to push Wayland. They took it over to kill it. X11 is not ideal but I don't think it'll really die. The big benefit of UNIX/Linux is choice. Including for a graphics stack. I'd use Wayland if it worked with KDE on FreeBSD but it doesn't yet. But I'm not in a hurry anyway.

> Because RedHat took over the maintenance and they want to push Wayland. They took it over to kill it.

Can we stop with these useless conteos? No one goddamn cares about linux desktop, this is the unfortunate state of things. X could be maintained, but no one goddamn cares about doing that ugly work, because they don’t get paid Cobol-bank money for maintaining an ugly legacy software that was designed at a time when GPUs didn’t exist.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#185

Post by kaba0 »

imiric wrote: post #143
miloignis wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recommend swapping your nix package to firefox-wayland -I've been using it for quite a while and it's been great. For me, it's been a huge improvement over X - thr lack of screen tearing when srolling and playing videos is huge. If an app uses one of the normal GUI toolkits, they don't normally have to do anything crazy to support wayland, so I'd be suprised if you need to swap to a whole new ecosystem (and there's…

Thanks, I'll try that, but the thing is that I haven't experienced screen tearing on X for many years now, on Intel, AMD or Nvidia cards, and even on high refresh rate displays (90/120hz). Sometimes when plugging in a second monitor I need to force full-screen composition with Nvidia cards to get rid of tearing, but I can always set this permanently in a config file, I just haven't gotten around to it. I really haven…

You don’t notice screen tearing on normal usage with most desktop environments on X due to them using compositors. Try disabling it, or alternatively, to just play a high-resolution video on a high-res screen. The latter will often have artifacts.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#186

Post by kaba0 »

imiric wrote: post #39
MarcusE1W wrote: post #3

I use KDE for a year now with Wayland. Works absolutely fine for me. My requirements are probably simple, just a laptop but it works.

I'm surprised whenever I hear Wayland works flawlessly for someone, since I've tried using it on the NixOS unstable channel for a few releases now, and there are a few major bugs that make it unusable for me. A show stopping one is that the bottom panel is stuck in the middle of the screen, with no way to move it down that I could find, and clicks register in completely different parts of the screen. It's difficult t…

> The fact each application needs to explicitly support Wayland

That’s not really the case, basically every framework supports both X and Wayland, out of the box. It is just sometimes marked as experimental/non-default by some software, e.g. firefox (which is not your average GTK/Qt app).

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#187

Post by kabes »

mardifoufs wrote: post #167
kabes wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My issues started since driver 545

Are you using Wayland? I'm curious since it seems like most people I've discussed with have confirmed that the 545 drivers improved things for them. I thought they might actually have fixed/improved the experience for most Wayland users but I guess things are never that simple!

Yes, wayland. With driver 545 as soon as my screen goes black (due to inactivity), it never goes out of that state anymore and I have to do a hard reboot.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#188

Post by mpol »

brnt wrote: post #121
vlovich123 wrote: post #90

I enabled wayland recently and there’s been a lot of annoyances to the point that I wonder why I bother considering X11 works without these issues. For example: * Chrome needs a bunch of extra flags to launch in Wayland mode * Firefox needs extra flags to launch in Wayland mode * Xwayland is just broken on Nvidia with both sides refusing to compromise (implicit vs explicit synchronization - Nvidia refuses to add impl…

I have three laptops each with Intel graphics, each from a different generation. They all have the same show stopping (as in screen locking gotta reset) bugs after a fresh distro install, no adjustments. But ofcourse, Wayland isn't the problem...

If the device locks up, is that really Wayland, not the kernel driver or mesa driver?

Here on HN I see a lot of popular opinions on Intel and their drivers. Even today, proposing it as a baseline for Wayland. But could it perhaps be that Intel is just really good at marketing? AMD might be less about marketing and just delivering good drivers.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#189

Post by k0k0 »

dheera wrote: post #85
lxe wrote: post #72

Wayland doesn't fractionally scale chrome, discord, vscode, spotify, beeper, and other appimage and non-native applications. So even if KDE enables it by default, most users will have to switch back to X.

Also, Chinese input breaks in Chrome on Wayland and they still haven't fixed this bug after 2+ years. Also, Nvidia drivers don't work with Wayland. So I'm still stuck with Xorg.

I have had no issues with Chinese IME (either ibus or fcitx5) using GTK4, iow using the --gtk-version=4 chrome flag.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.0 Is Enabling Wayland by Default

#190

Post by npteljes »

vlovich123 wrote: post #90

I enabled wayland recently and there’s been a lot of annoyances to the point that I wonder why I bother considering X11 works without these issues. For example: * Chrome needs a bunch of extra flags to launch in Wayland mode * Firefox needs extra flags to launch in Wayland mode * Xwayland is just broken on Nvidia with both sides refusing to compromise (implicit vs explicit synchronization - Nvidia refuses to add impl…

Another regression is that KeePassX/C AutoType doesn't work with Wayland, so now instead of a simple CTRL+V in KeePassXC, I have to separately copy and paste the user and the pass.

I'm another X holdout because of random issues like this. X just works for me, and I don't have the time and energy to care.

https://github.com/keepassxreboot/keepassxc/issues/2281

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