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Nicotine (2016)

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Re: Nicotine (2016)

#71

Post by Findecanor »

steeleyespan wrote: post #27
goodluckchuck wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean smoking is terrible for you. As the cited studies indicate, nicotine itself (delivered by patched / gum) is fairly harmless. Not completely risk free, but nothing at all like smoking.

There's some studies suggesting nordic Snus (like all natural chew w/o chemicals added) is fairly harmless. Anecdotally I've read people highly addicted to it, so very suspicious of any claim that nicotine itself isn't addictive and just smoking is.

Snus is quite common in my country, Sweden. Many users are former smokers who "quit" by using snus instead as their source of nicotine. Users I know have said that they feel that it is highly addictive.

Studies of snus users have indicated increased risks of cancer in the mouth, throat and gastrointestinal system but have not been conclusive as to how. There's also a newer type of snus not made from tobacco, with pure nicotine as a separate ingredient, but it has been studied much less.

Nicotine is still widely considered harmful for the cardiovascular system though. I've had two surgeries this past year and been told to not even chew nicotine gum for a week before because of how nicotine in my system could lead to complications.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#72

Post by bartwr »

I used to be a daily smoker for over 2y and a casual/social smoker for close to a decade. Since moving to US, for the last decade, I don't smoke as "nobody" smokes here (compared to Europe). I smoke now 1-2 cigarettes a year, mostly when visiting Europe and with smoker friends. (I never got addicted and never had any problem quiting cold turkey; I smoked because it was great social relationship builder - some of my best friends are people met on cigarette breaks).

Sometimes I use nicotine gums / patches as a dieting aid (effective appetite suppressant).

And I want to warn against this premise of short half life. This is not true in general. There are active metabolites like cotinine with elimination half life of 20h+, depending on your liver enzymes, gender, ethnicity.

If I chew a nicotine gum around noon, I have trouble sleeping the whole following night with my brain unable to calm down, mild jaw clenching etc.

So yes, moldafinil is a terrible stimulant due to too long half life, but so is nicotine (for many). I definitely don't recommend for that purpose. Maybe for extreme (crash) dieting, but this is unhealthy in general.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#73

Post by deegles »

dijit wrote: post #32

After being on IRC for the best part of two decades (and the fringe groups who frequent the medium) I have seen the word “nootropics” banded about. The first time, I thought it was a fun idea but nothing I wanted, see; my brain is all I have so I dont much fancy experimenting with it- this is also why I avoided alcohol and coffee despite social pressures. The community that formed went away as quickly as it had been…

The best nootropic is really high quality, regular sleep, regular exercise, and good diet. If you don't have the basics down, no supplement will make up for it.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#75

Post by reactordev »

insanitybit wrote: post #65
reactordev wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The withdrawal effects are more like kicking a heroin addiction.

That doesn't sound true.

Try it then. As someone who smoked and quit and have had friends who smoked and quit who also had heroin habits, they corroborate the difficulty. It’s a different type of struggle but the struggle is strong just the same.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#76

Post by imsurgio »

I am a smoker. I wouldn't advise this. Before you get any stimulant effects. Which are minimal. You get very sick at first. By the time you have enough tolerance you are addicted physically. Some can quit easy but it can be a slippery slope. It's too risky as you don't know how hard it is to quit for you in advance.

I've tried off and on to quit for 20 years at least. Don't do it, it's a lot of work to get past the sickness. If I weren't young and ignorant, I'd have never started.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#77

Post by hatsix »

trident5000 wrote: post #25
mijoharas wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like caffeine?

Is that a counterpoint? Pointing to something unrelated from the conversation. Maybe both arnt great for you?

it's a great counterpoint, because they're is a lot of literature on the health effects of caffeine.

> Maybe both aren't great for you?

Maybe? You are the one making strong assertions about vasoconstrictors. Maybe you should take this opportunity to challenge your beliefs on this by digging into scientific literature.

Also, "aren't great" is such a softening of your original opinion "just terrible". Why argue for your ignorance when there is actual scientific literature?

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#78

Post by reactordev »

sfeng wrote: post #66
reactordev wrote: post #54

>”…and is addictive to some degree” I stopped reading after this part. I’m sorry, but passing off decades of research as “to some degree” when it’s been found to be as addictive as heroin. [0] So it’s completely asinine to say “to some degree”. By all means, go chew some nicotine gum, you’ll be wanting more in an hour. Next thing you know you’re eating a pack a day, for 30 years, until your arteries hardened and you…

It would probably be useful to actually read before you comment. He meticulously cites the sources of his claims with actual studies.

>”…My take away is that there is addiction but it’s drastically overestimated”

It goes on and on. The author is ignorant.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#79

Post by reactordev »

thebigspacefuck wrote: post #64
reactordev wrote: post #54

>”…and is addictive to some degree” I stopped reading after this part. I’m sorry, but passing off decades of research as “to some degree” when it’s been found to be as addictive as heroin. [0] So it’s completely asinine to say “to some degree”. By all means, go chew some nicotine gum, you’ll be wanting more in an hour. Next thing you know you’re eating a pack a day, for 30 years, until your arteries hardened and you…

You really should have kept reading because this is addressed

And dismissed over and over again. The author is playing with cyanide and doesn’t even understand that.

Re: Nicotine (2016)

#80

Post by cmrdporcupine »

reactordev wrote: post #61
mpreda wrote: post #41

I'm a non smoker, I never smoked. Once I decided to try a nicotine chewing gum, took one pillow and chewed it thoroughly. After about 5-10minutes I suffered some very very severe effects, including: I started sweating extremelly such that all my clothes become wet quickly and sweat was dripping down my nose, ears, and into my eyes. I felt an intense and urgent need to urinate and defecate, which luckily I could do on…

Welcome to nicotine poisoning. You are only supposed to chew until you get flavor, then suck on it like you would spitting tobacco except not spitting. When you get a craving, you chew a few more times. The symptoms you describe are classic nicotine poisoning symptoms. Sweats, expulsions of fluids, rapid heart rate, disorientation.

It also describes what I felt like the first time I ever tried a cigarette.
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