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.NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

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Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#91

Post by scns »

biglyburrito wrote: post #88
solarkraft wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Rider can be pretty heavy but Apple Silicon eats it up. (And to be fair to Rider, it was still pretty good even on Intel machines). Rider (like all JetBrains IDEs) gobbles RAM and sometimes needs its time to think. But what makes it so, so much better than Visual Studio (besides a minimum of effort spent on usable design) is that it doesn't randomly completely lock up the UI for several (sometimes tens) of seconds.…

The startup time of JetBrains Rider is so nice & quick. Going back to using Visual Studio 2022 after two years on the latest Rider version felt sluggish in a bunch of ways.

Thats crazy. VS is written in C++ and Rider in Java.

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#92

Post by biglyburrito »

supertron wrote: post #70
skrebbel wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that many of MS’s “open source” libraries (eg EF, OData) are half-assed, badly run projects. I’m also still mad at them for competing against amazing stuff like ServiceStack (a real OSS project from the community, and the best way to run REST APIs I’ve ever seen) with “official” but worse stuff like ASP.NET Web API. They do this a lot, some OSS gets popular but instead of embracing it, they make a half-assed…

> I agree that many of MS’s “open source” libraries (eg EF, OData) are half-assed, badly run projects. Just as a counterpoint to this, I have found Entity Framework (Core) to be an extremely nice and very productive dev experience, with a lot of constant improvements in every release. MS don't always get it right, but I definitely wouldn't call EF a "half-assed, badly run project" by a long stretch. (Though there are…

OData is particularly atrocious, even the latest version (8.x). Entity Framework is getting better... EF8 may be the first version that achieves feature parity with (legacy) Entity Framework 6.x.

If you're still using .NET Framework at this point, that's your own fault (or, more likely, your org's). They have been communicating for _YEARS_ that .NET Framework was on its way out, and provided support for .NET Standard 2.0 as a stepping stone to .NET Core & beyond (i.e. .NET 5+). There are some apps & frameworks that don't really have a modern .NET equivalent, but you won't find me shedding any tears over the lack of a direct upgrade path for Windows Communication Foundation (WCF). =P

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#93

Post by torginus »

andrewstuart wrote: post #12

Who is using .NET on Linux? I'm interested to hear success stories. Sounds like a a great way to build and deploy applications.

We are - we are in the process of transitioning our ASP.NET based backend from Windows to Linux. Linux machines are cheaper and easier to administer than Windows based ones.

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#94

Post by pansa2 »

criddell wrote: post #77
pansa2 wrote: post #72

2MB for a standalone “Hello World” binary in C# is a similar size to one in Go. Do both languages produce similar-sized binaries for larger projects as well? If so, would C# be a good choice for writing cross-platform command-line applications? It seems that C# can produce easily-distributable binaries, while also hitting a sweet-spot in language design - not super complex like C++ or Rust, and also not overly simpli…

Aside from syntax preferences, why and when would one choose Go over C#?

When Go first came out, it was better than C# in terms of support for concurrency, stand-alone binaries, and cross-platform. It seems that C# has done a lot of catching up since then, though.

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#95

Post by kmac_ »

supertron wrote: post #60
andrewstuart wrote: post #12

Who is using .NET on Linux? I'm interested to hear success stories. Sounds like a a great way to build and deploy applications.

I am. I've been developing with .NET since the start and my current workflow is really the smoothest and most productive (and most enjoyable!) I've ever had: I develop solely on Mac (JetBrains Rider), compiling/debugging Mac binaries locally - no containers - unless I need any external dependencies like eg. Postgres. On M1 MacBook Pro the experience is blazing fast - and Rider can be pretty heavy but Apple Silicon ea…

I absolutely agree, .NET is so well designed on many levels: portability, core framework, documentation, support since the beginning. MS has proven that they can provide stable development platforms (well, except UI). If someone rejects .NET just because it's from MS, they are missing out.

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#96

Post by Decabytes »

andrewstuart wrote: post #12

Who is using .NET on Linux? I'm interested to hear success stories. Sounds like a a great way to build and deploy applications.

I use .NET on Linux and the experience with Rider has been great. The workflow transfers really well between Mac, Windows, and Linux, and everything works the way you expect. The only problems I run into are that there are still things that are Windows focused. For example MAUI does not run on Linux which is a shame because we could use another cross platform GUI.

There are still bugs, for example I ran into one with Polyglot Notebooks not working on Manjaro or Pop!_OS https://github.com/dotnet/interactive/issues/3159 but hopefully that will just get better with time.

I think the biggest with .NET is that it spent so long being Windows only. A lot of people just developed workflows in other languages. It also took time before .NET core, now just .NET really became first class on Linux. With .NET 8 this will get a lot better, and to my understanding will allow the popular Game Engine Godot to be able to target the web with C# builds. This will allow them to go back to having one Godot binary instead of two.

The thing that has me scratching my head though is I can't believe they still don't have System.CommandLine in the standard lib. We want our cli programs please!

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#97

Post by hailruda »

scns wrote: post #91
biglyburrito wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The startup time of JetBrains Rider is so nice & quick. Going back to using Visual Studio 2022 after two years on the latest Rider version felt sluggish in a bunch of ways.

Thats crazy. VS is written in C++ and Rider in Java.

Most of Visual Studio is written in C# since VS2010. [0]

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_Studio#2010

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#98

Post by torginus »

skrebbel wrote: post #28
devjab wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We do, in the few things we haven’t yet migrated away from C#. I’m curious as to why you wouldn’t, it’s much cheaper than deploying on windows since you’ll likely need a license for that. We use it for a range of things. Mostly related to the legacy software of when our developers were mostly C# developers. Which isn’t how things are now, as C# has often stood in the way of our ability to deliver business value at a…

I agree that many of MS’s “open source” libraries (eg EF, OData) are half-assed, badly run projects. I’m also still mad at them for competing against amazing stuff like ServiceStack (a real OSS project from the community, and the best way to run REST APIs I’ve ever seen) with “official” but worse stuff like ASP.NET Web API. They do this a lot, some OSS gets popular but instead of embracing it, they make a half-assed…

I think .NET-s unique strength comes from its batteries-included approach, very useful in enterprise environments where every piece of software needs to be audited.

That means Microsoft strives to provide a first-party library for every business case.

That said, you can still use ServiceStack and Newtonsoft.JSON if you wish to.

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#99

Post by lemper »

solarkraft wrote: post #86

What the .NET team does on the technical side is almost universally wonderful. They've (ironically?) been a bit more successful than the Java folks at establishing multiple serious languages of different kinds running on and interoperating via the same runtime. But it's still a Microsoft project and their sword keeps looming over its head. There have been some heavy-handed anti-developer choices in the past and one c…

makes me remember about that meme where it depicts microsoft as an org with many divisions pointing guns at each other. devdiv is the good guys while sales dept. is the hated one.

Re: .NET 8 Standalone 50% Smaller On Linux

#100

Post by zerr »

criddell wrote: post #77
pansa2 wrote: post #72

2MB for a standalone “Hello World” binary in C# is a similar size to one in Go. Do both languages produce similar-sized binaries for larger projects as well? If so, would C# be a good choice for writing cross-platform command-line applications? It seems that C# can produce easily-distributable binaries, while also hitting a sweet-spot in language design - not super complex like C++ or Rust, and also not overly simpli…

Aside from syntax preferences, why and when would one choose Go over C#?

You don't. Production ready statically compiled native C# is a death sentence for Golang :)
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