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Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

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Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#101

Post by WaitWaitWha »

andix wrote: post #93

Why use Outlook without Office 365 or Exchange at all? Only reason I could think of: some very specialized extensions that are only available for Outlook. I'm really happy that Thunderbird recently got some updates, I think it's the only good free desktop mail client that is still around. Evolution looks really dated nowadays. Personally I can recommend eM Client for Windows users as an Outlook replacement (and they…

I use Thunderbird on my mobile and desktop.

Thunderbird needs to get to the 21st century before general public starts swapping out MS or Google mail, calendaring, and contact solutions. As it is, the GUIs on need a Jacob Nielsen-style usability revamp.

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#102

Post by [deleted] »

this_steve_j wrote: post #76

Oh wow, it posts your cleartext email credentials to an API endpoint called “/ows/beta/ShadowService/getShadowToken”. But it least it calls the password string a “Secret” in the JSON payload so you can REST assured knowing the Shadow Service agents will handle this data appropriately.

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#103

Post by andix »

WaitWaitWha wrote: post #101
andix wrote: post #93

Why use Outlook without Office 365 or Exchange at all? Only reason I could think of: some very specialized extensions that are only available for Outlook. I'm really happy that Thunderbird recently got some updates, I think it's the only good free desktop mail client that is still around. Evolution looks really dated nowadays. Personally I can recommend eM Client for Windows users as an Outlook replacement (and they…

I use Thunderbird on my mobile and desktop. Thunderbird needs to get to the 21st century before general public starts swapping out MS or Google mail, calendaring, and contact solutions. As it is, the GUIs on need a Jacob Nielsen-style usability revamp.

Are you using the new/beta UI already?

Thunderbird still has a long way to go, but made already a huge step forward, away from the ~20 year old UI they were keeping and cherishing.

I think they also need to get rid of tabs ASAP (at least disable them by default). The concept of tabs just doesn't feel right for an email client.

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#104

Post by ubermonkey »

bombcar wrote: post #88
jabroni_salad wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"new outlook" is just the webmail, you can see it at outlook.office365.com if you want. It has a couple benefits. The search is better since it isn't limited to your local cache, and your scheduled emails don't require that you have outlook running on the desktop at go time. I try not to use it otherwise.

Search is the one thing that's been absolutely horrendous - I can be staring at an email, search for a phrase or similar from that email, and it can't find it. And good luck searching for calendar items.

I find, and have always found, that search in Outlook is so bad it's just not worth doing.

Search in the native Mac Mail client? Crazy good. Very reliable. Never let me down.

Mail clients are kind of all terrible, because right now my favorite one is just the one that does the things that really OUGHT to be the bare minimum:

* Reliably send and receive mail

* Support IMAP and Exchange

* Have the option for local storage of some or all of the mail corpus on any given account

* Have fast, accurate, reliable search

* Have a rules/filters function (though honestly this is usually something better done server-side)

* Have a well-designed, coherent interface that makes rapid work possible

* Be at least halfway attractive to look at

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#105

Post by lostlogin »

lostlogin wrote: post #79
Tijdreiziger wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the big tech companies do this kind of thing to varying degrees. Gmail (email service) and Gmail (app). Apple TV (device), Apple TV (iOS app), Apple TV (Mac app), Apple TV (Apple TV app) and Apple TV+ (streaming service).

This is the and Apple is mystify given that they are very focused on image and advertising. However I tolerate that more, as fixing formatting in my job is actual hell, people are tying to get work done and the tools are objectively broken and it’s a de facto standard.

Argh.

This is accurate and Apple is mystify given that they are very focused on image and advertising. However I tolerate that more than Microsoft, as fixing formatting in my job is actual hell, people are tying to get work done and the tools are objectively broken and word is a de facto standard.

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#106

Post by nacs »

this_steve_j wrote: post #76

Oh wow, it posts your cleartext email credentials to an API endpoint called “/ows/beta/ShadowService/getShadowToken”. But it least it calls the password string a “Secret” in the JSON payload so you can REST assured knowing the Shadow Service agents will handle this data appropriately.

It's also comforting that the path says "beta" so you know your email credentials are being sent to a secure location.

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#107

Post by KRAKRISMOTT »

drooopy wrote: post #69
KRAKRISMOTT wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard he used to use the alias Dave Cutler and was the inspiration behind Clippy

I heard that he was called Art Vandelay during that time.

I heard he was Veridian Dynamics' greatest CEO

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#108

Post by robjan »

nashashmi wrote: post #67

OT: Classic Outlook can be a database and file server portal. I have never seen anyone use it for this purpose. I tried to build an application using this feature. It was difficult because of how poorly documented this is.

Aren't you describing Lotus Notes?

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#109

Post by Beldin »

WaitWaitWha wrote: post #101
andix wrote: post #93

Why use Outlook without Office 365 or Exchange at all? Only reason I could think of: some very specialized extensions that are only available for Outlook. I'm really happy that Thunderbird recently got some updates, I think it's the only good free desktop mail client that is still around. Evolution looks really dated nowadays. Personally I can recommend eM Client for Windows users as an Outlook replacement (and they…

I use Thunderbird on my mobile and desktop. Thunderbird needs to get to the 21st century before general public starts swapping out MS or Google mail, calendaring, and contact solutions. As it is, the GUIs on need a Jacob Nielsen-style usability revamp.

Is your problem a UI problem or a functionality problem?

I'm asking, because I can understand wanting functionality (eg. decent calendar integration). I don't understand UI complaints but am willing to imagine "it could be better" (eg. UI-complaints of Gimp)... except I've used Thunderbird, and the UI does its job fine.

Sure, maybe with some MS ribbon-alike thingy it would work better for some, and maybe I'm a dinosaur, but most UI changes in programs I've used the last decade were either shrug or a bad idea. So I've become very hesitant about overhauling UIs simply because they come across outdated to some.

Re: Microsoft lays hands on login data: Beware of the new Outlook

#110

Post by jahsome »

isodev wrote: post #82
jahsome wrote: post #59

There's something strangely ominous about a lengthy, full screen German-language popup.

Could it be the cookie prompt? The page has 15+ trackers on it, so it must definitely ask for consent, and it shows as a big dialog with 3 buttons at the bottom.

Yes, it appeared it was. But as a non-german speaker, how would I know?
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