Until someone gives me a convincing reason why Iago did it, Othello is NOT solved.
Othello Is Solved?
131–140 of 285 posts
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Weakly solving" a game is a technical term. If you have weakly solved a game, you can play perfectly (achieve the optimal result) when the game starts from its initial position. If you have strongly solved it, you can play perfectly starting from any position.
Sorry, I was unclear: I know what weakly solved means. What I find curious is that the title and abstract refer to "solved", and don't mention what they actually mean. To me "solved" would suggest "strongly solved". But perhaps equating "solved" with "weakly solved" is default in this area? Still, I would like expect an abstract to say something like that explicitly. But given the overall state of that paper I think…
> To me "solved" would suggest "strongly solved". But perhaps equating "solved" with "weakly solved" is default in this area?
It's the default for all reasonable games - statespace is huge (i.e. tic-tac-toe is childsplay) and simple strategies don't exist (that'd make bad human game). You can't even iterate all positions - even less prove them all for one outcome.
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#133For those of you who think Othello is trivial, try Zebra. Original author’s website: http://radagast.se/othello/ A github source: https://github.com/hoshir/zebra
for those not getting what is "Othello" - it is also called Reversi
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#134weakly solved
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#135This is cool. I solved a simpler game about 15 years ago that my brother and I used to play: an African game with about 10 pits on each side of the board that hold stones. I coded up an alpha-beta engine for it, and discovered crazy always win strategies to match how my brother and I played. Suddenly I would win all the games, and then he never wanted to play again. This was a classic match up of a computer scientist…
I did something similar for my (then) favourite game Pentago , with similar results: I drained all the fun from it.
This is usually my approach when I'm playing too much of a game. I cracked my sudoku addiction by writing a solver. Got a lot less fun when I could tell my computer to solve it how I would solve it.
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#136[dead]
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
I only skimmed it, but it looks like they described this to me. The next sentence: > Although there are numerous ways to select subsets that would prove the initial position results in a draw, we used algorithm 1 to obtain a small subset. Algorithm 1: > We developed an algorithm that requires predictive scores for all positions with 50 empty squares and returns a subset such that if the all positions belonging to tha…
Algorithm 1 doesn't say shit! It says "pick the best move", or "pick all the moves". From start of game to 50 squares left is enumerable. From 36 moves left to end-of-game is apparently solvable. The middle is the combinatorial explosion, and he avoids explaining how he navigates it.
> From start of game to 50 squares left is enumerable.
A nitpick, but I don't think you meant to say "enumerable" here
"enumerable" means "able to be enumerated, or counted"
https://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/Enumerate
"innumerable" means "unable to be numbered, or counted"
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
>That means it's still possible to win a game by intentionally deviating from the perfect sequence Someone with perfect strategy would have an answer for any deviation. Playing imperfectly would likely get you into a losing position. There is no way to go from a game being drawn if played perfectly to being winning if the then loser were to be using perfect strategy.
> Someone with perfect strategy would have an answer for any deviation. Someone verified there is a perfect strategy, using tons of computational resources and lots of time. The game tree they explored may have millions of billions of nodes, of which only the top layers could be saved. To use a perfect strategy in an actual game, you need to have it stored in some format that allows near-real time lookups. Such is th…
> Such is the difference between weakly and strongly solving.
no, you described difference between storing the result and not storing it
strongly solving means allowing arbitrary amount of mistakes from either player before giving to the solver
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
Mancala and connect four are classic examples of solved games. computer scientist vs. an optometrist. What does being an optometrist have to do with anything?
One solves problems and the other is a computer scientist.
Well as a computer scientist and programmer, I for one laughed.
Re: Othello Is Solved?
#140Othello is a great game to demonstrate how powerful some basic heuristics can be. There are certain squares that you should avoid placing pebble on as the game develops - equally there are squares that you should definitely try and place a pebble on if you can. Implementing these rules can give you a fairly decent opponent and it's interesting to see how quickly people will ascribe "intelligence" to something that is…
Implementing these rules can give you a fairly decent opponent and it's interesting to see how quickly people will ascribe "intelligence" to something that is very simple. Who is actually "ascribing intelligence" to this? Othello has been on $10 LCD games that take double AA batteries.
People see something behaving based on some very simple rules and assume that it is “thinking”.