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One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

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Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#111

Queue people blogging about their monthly “sleep fast” for optimized mood and focus.

plenty of people force themselves to stay up all night once in a blue moon for mental health reasons, all without blogging about it.

Just sharing an anecdote - I noticed this effect in college for myself. Since then i do one or two all nighters a year specifically for this

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#112
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tapering off very slowly (over weeks or months) will probably work better than cold turkey.

I’m just now sure how to taper off. They don’t come in smaller doses than 5mg and that’s where I’m at.

Split it until it’s 0mg.

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#114

Having suffered from severe depression for over forty years, this reminds me of when I was 17, 18, etc. and suddenly discovered that if I stayed up for two days, the problem went away. So I knew this a very long time ago; but it always seemed to me that, besides smoking, this was just about one of the worst habits you could develop. By my mid-twenties, I had stopped.

I recently was forced off of SSRIs after nearly ten years because I lost my psychiatrist and couldn't get a new one because the waitlists were ridiculous. After 10 years on them, the next 6 months were absolute hell (i legit thought at one point I might go full Joaquin Phoenix in Joker) but I made it through, no small part thanks to my wonderful amazing wife. Rebound depression have been an issue - though in general…

Just a side note for anyone reading: you can get an SSRI prescription from your GP (general practitioner i.e. normal doctor) you don’t need to go through a psychiatrist.

This is especially true if you are at risk for withdrawal, they will want to prevent that.

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't you try it and see? Some of my best sleeps were after a sleepless night and for only like 1-3 hours, caffeine or other stimulants in the blood be damned Edit: also make sure you have bright blue light during wakeup/morning/day and mellow non-overhead orangey/amber/yellow light (nothing east of yellow) at evening/night. Red 2 hours before bedtime for bonus "points"

> Why don't you try it and see? I feel great after a few beers, but keeping that state is a very bad idea. "try it and see" is not a great idea when it comes to your brain.

I don't think you build up a "Beer Debt" that grows as it depletes like sleep and hunger. Cute wrong example but there's really nothing all that malevolent or irresponsible about the suggestion. Maybe keep it to the weekend (like don't start till Friday/Sat night) and obviously you need the set it up so you don't have to be places or hold meaningful convos although Im not going to rule them totally out

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't you try it and see? Some of my best sleeps were after a sleepless night and for only like 1-3 hours, caffeine or other stimulants in the blood be damned Edit: also make sure you have bright blue light during wakeup/morning/day and mellow non-overhead orangey/amber/yellow light (nothing east of yellow) at evening/night. Red 2 hours before bedtime for bonus "points"

My experience does not match up with yours here. Given work deadlines I have a lot of experience with full all-nighters and 1-3 hour nights.

Can you comment on sleep hygiene and the stuff i mentioned about light? Do you sleep in complete darkness in a slightly cooler ambient setting and really get a lot of bright line first thing at waketime?

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#117
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

plenty of people force themselves to stay up all night once in a blue moon for mental health reasons, all without blogging about it.

Really, this is a thing? I’ve never heard about it. I used to stay up late sometimes when I was younger, but that was because the world went to sleep and I felt at peace doing my own thing. It wasn’t because I was trying to feel better the next day, in fact it tended to screw the next day up.

the second day, you slept poorly, mistakes don’t matter. and that’s just an added bonus on top of the biological changes.

it is more about the third day.

not surprising to not hear about it. it isn’t permanent, so catching a “practitioner” in the right moment to bring up the topic, while being in the right moment, is unlikely.

plus, bodies are weird, and laws are scary. should everyone do this? probably not, and probably for differing reasons.

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#118

Having suffered from severe depression for over forty years, this reminds me of when I was 17, 18, etc. and suddenly discovered that if I stayed up for two days, the problem went away. So I knew this a very long time ago; but it always seemed to me that, besides smoking, this was just about one of the worst habits you could develop. By my mid-twenties, I had stopped.

I recently was forced off of SSRIs after nearly ten years because I lost my psychiatrist and couldn't get a new one because the waitlists were ridiculous. After 10 years on them, the next 6 months were absolute hell (i legit thought at one point I might go full Joaquin Phoenix in Joker) but I made it through, no small part thanks to my wonderful amazing wife. Rebound depression have been an issue - though in general…

> would actually fix the rebounds for a bit.

I can't prove it, but even dumb teenage me felt instinctively that extreme sleep deprivation was likely to take a long and possibly permanent toll. I don't think anything that extreme can really be practiced in moderation, because it's more like taking heroin than eating too many cakes, etc., i.e., it's not a 'granular' indulgence.

I would hesitate to call this a hot take on my part, since I am guessing that in that period of my life, I probably stayed up for two days on several hundred occasions, if not more.

For anyone else suffering from severe depression, this is an easy answer, maybe; but there are better easy answers than this. Cannabis (I am not a partaker since I was an student) would be better than this.

Really, do anything but this. It's not 'free'; nothing that works is free.

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#119
post #6

This must be why new parents always seem so bubbly and happy! But seriously, that’s very interesting and explains what I’ve experienced. I’ve been in a depression since quitting my phd a couple months ago and not having a direction in life, but whenever I have trouble sleeping I end up feeling better the next day. Maybe I’ll trying utilizing it to get my portfolio looking better.

I went several years more or less depressed and observed this phenomenon and utilized it. Night of Kerbal Space Program and next day the world is much better. For a while. Also, a lot fuzzier. And I couldn't code very well (just good enough to do my job so everyone was happy but I could feel slipping). Therapy and SSRI:s worked much better in the end. But, for sure in a pinch it does alleviate unbearable darkness. Th…

> Therapy and SSRI:s worked much better in the end.

How did you find that therapy helped you? I've started therapy a few months back and so far I can't find all that much value in it. They can't fix any of the stuff that is making me depressed, so it mostly feels like I'm mainly getting self help style advice.

Re: One sleepless night can rapidly reverse depression for several days in mice

#120
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really, this is a thing? I’ve never heard about it. I used to stay up late sometimes when I was younger, but that was because the world went to sleep and I felt at peace doing my own thing. It wasn’t because I was trying to feel better the next day, in fact it tended to screw the next day up.

There's something to it. Also with dissociatives. Something about these substances or practices can help "reset" you like pulling the plug on an electrical device and forcing it to reboot with refreshed state

pushing the system to a point where it flips over to a different operating mode. overheating your phone until it reboots. ctrl+alt+del.

it usually feels a little precarious. maybe not for others. but there’s definitely an aspect of futzing with your mortality, with your primary systems.

but if it works…

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