New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed • Hacker News Board

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#51

Post by chiefalchemist » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:42 AM UTC

david-gpu wrote: post #38

The title blames "helicopter parenting" while the actual study blames the lack of independent mobility: > Considerable research, mostly in Europe, has focused on children’s independent mobility (CIM), defined as children’s freedom to travel in their neighborhood or city without adult accompaniment Isn't that lack of independent mobility largely caused by car-centric urban planning? Children and teens can't safely roa…

> Suburbia may have little traffic, but they are also devoid of "third places" where teens can be teens.

When I was a teen there was no pre-made concept of "third places". We made our own. Most of the time, this meant being outside doing something active. We didn't want to be inside. We didn't want to watch TV or even binge-play video games.

We created our own ways of keeping us busy, entertained, socially connected, etc.

Let's not forget, scarcity breeds creativity and innovation.

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#52

Post by voisin » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:43 AM UTC

willcipriano wrote: post #50

Dah00n wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Isn't that lack of independent mobility largely caused by car-centric urban planning? If it is, then comparing EU versus US should show a clear difference, as US cities are much, much more car-centric than most (any?) EU city. Personally, I don't see “children’s independent mobility” as a problem (I live in Denmark). At least, not an issue that is any different from when I was a child. The only major difference I se…

Growing up in a rural area I rode my bike all over the place. Should see a difference with rural vs urban as well.

I grew up in a rural area as well but in my mind it is no different or possibly worse - farther distances meant biking was a necessity versus walking, zero bike infrastructure so I had to be commingled with vehicular traffic, and that traffic was going much faster than in a city due to the wide openness of the roads and no need to stop for far distances. I think it was far more dangerous.

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#53

Post by southerntofu » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:45 AM UTC

skrebbel wrote: post #20

callalex wrote: post #2

Maybe the earth/environment collapsing around them while nobody does anything to fix it is also depressing.

Nobody? All the solar stats are up and the right, IEA expects fossil fuel consumption will soon plateau, solar panel prices keep going down faster than experts predict, seas are getting flooded with windmill parks etc etc.

What you're saying is similar to claiming fixing a leak on your faucet is gonna fix the global water crisis we are starting to face.

Assuming you are in good faith, you are probably very uninformed about the state of the climate crisis, pollution crisis, and everything that comes along. We are far from the targets set by IPCC to ensure human survival, and they are one of the most optimistic organizations out there when it comes to projections, as some indicators are now much worse than their "worst scenario" projections.

Solar panels isn't gonna cut it. No single isolated change is gonna cut it. Nothing short of a global revolution tearing down industrial capitalism and consumerist culture. I mean, a solarpunk alternative sounds great, but is so far 100% unrealistic, while local-first permaculture-oriented anarchic societies have proved their worth/resilience throughout history/pre-history.

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#54

Post by chownie » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:50 AM UTC

chiefalchemist wrote: post #51

david-gpu wrote: post #38

The title blames "helicopter parenting" while the actual study blames the lack of independent mobility: > Considerable research, mostly in Europe, has focused on children’s independent mobility (CIM), defined as children’s freedom to travel in their neighborhood or city without adult accompaniment Isn't that lack of independent mobility largely caused by car-centric urban planning? Children and teens can't safely roa…

> Suburbia may have little traffic, but they are also devoid of "third places" where teens can be teens. When I was a teen there was no pre-made concept of "third places". We made our own. Most of the time, this meant being outside doing something active. We didn't want to be inside. We didn't want to watch TV or even binge-play video games. We created our own ways of keeping us busy, entertained, socially connected,…

You may not have used them but there were definitely third spaces for children and teens in the form of play areas and parks. Add skate parks to that list if you grew up in the early 00s, and probably something else before that.

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#55

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:51 AM UTC

voisin wrote: post #52

willcipriano wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Growing up in a rural area I rode my bike all over the place. Should see a difference with rural vs urban as well.

I grew up in a rural area as well but in my mind it is no different or possibly worse - farther distances meant biking was a necessity versus walking, zero bike infrastructure so I had to be commingled with vehicular traffic, and that traffic was going much faster than in a city due to the wide openness of the roads and no need to stop for far distances. I think it was far more dangerous.

[deleted]

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#56

Post by rmbyrro » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:53 AM UTC

persponsibility wrote: post #4

I got excited when I saw something about helicopters. There are hardly ever any articles about helicopters on HN. I have a commercial helicopter license and almost 900 hours of combined helicopter and airplane flight time. If any extra rich people in the bay area or Sacramento want to buy a heli I will be your personal pilot available 24/7. Helis can go almost anywhere. I love to fly but it is hard to fly them unless…

Best comment on this thread made me laugh

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#57

Post by southerntofu » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:53 AM UTC

hiAndrewQuinn wrote: post #25

skrebbel wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody? All the solar stats are up and the right, IEA expects fossil fuel consumption will soon plateau, solar panel prices keep going down faster than experts predict, seas are getting flooded with windmill parks etc etc.

I don't see why you're getting downvoted. There is an ocean of difference between "we're on track to fix things" and "nobody's doing anything at all", yes, but it does nobody any good to pretend we haven't even gotten on the boat yet. They'll just reach the assumption that it's 100% hopeless.

No, we haven't gotten on the boat. Who cares how dirty energy is when so much of it is wasted? Who cares if electricity comes from solar or wind, if you're still adding PFAS to any furniture and other dirty chemicals in all food supply chains.

Industrial lobbies (aka "green capitalism") are trying to frame the debate as a question of clean energies, but for decades scientists have known and studied that consuming less, and more durable products is the only way out of this global crisis. Another example, industrial organic agriculture (yes that's a thing) is still very damaging to the environment in many ways (eg. contributing to desertification of soils), while permaculture/agroforestry is good for everyone but less profitable.

So i replied to the original comment in good faith, but such arguments are usually pushed by industrialists who explicitly profit from destroying the environment and silencing the narratives of actual scientists and environmentalists. Capitalism is what destroyed everything (see also scientists naming this geological era "capitalocene"), and nothing it can produce it can fix the inherent death-bringing at its core.

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#58

Post by chiefalchemist » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:55 AM UTC

jtrn wrote: post #30

Just my personal experience working as a psychologist with kids: The kids who were overly protected had about the same amount of problems as the kids from seriously neglected homes. So when I want to make my case for NOT overprotecting kids, I say: "If you really want to damage your kid: Protect them from all adversity." I do think that the whole "suicide is increasing" trope is seldom put in context. Of course, it's…

> By contrast, it is so good to see that death by drowning and car accidents have plummeted over the last 50 years.

Yes, less deaths are obviously a positive. However, could this be because of helicopter'ing adults? From kids not being allowed to be kids and put themselves in adverse places and face tough decisions?

Mom won't let Johnny drive, she drives instead.

Dad won't let Jane go out with friends on a camping trip.

Those will save lives, yes? Adversity by definition means risk. Is it possible that eventally these kids will grow up and in say 20 years become adult suicides or maybe don't go that far but are joy-less dysfunctional (?) adults? And eventually they pass that "DNA" along to their kids?

Helicopter parenting has longer term implications that we have yet to face. We can't have adversity without risk.

Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#59

Post by MrRolleyes » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:58 AM UTC

david-gpu wrote: post #38

The title blames "helicopter parenting" while the actual study blames the lack of independent mobility: > Considerable research, mostly in Europe, has focused on children’s independent mobility (CIM), defined as children’s freedom to travel in their neighborhood or city without adult accompaniment Isn't that lack of independent mobility largely caused by car-centric urban planning? Children and teens can't safely roa…

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Re: New Study Says Maybe Helicopter Parenting Is Making Kids Depressed

#60

Post by MrRolleyes » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 10:59 AM UTC

persponsibility wrote: post #4

I got excited when I saw something about helicopters. There are hardly ever any articles about helicopters on HN. I have a commercial helicopter license and almost 900 hours of combined helicopter and airplane flight time. If any extra rich people in the bay area or Sacramento want to buy a heli I will be your personal pilot available 24/7. Helis can go almost anywhere. I love to fly but it is hard to fly them unless…

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