The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete • Hacker News Board

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#151

Post by FireBeyond » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:19 AM UTC

Kreutzer wrote: post #69

romafirst3 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no war going on. Wars happen between nations and between armies. Whatever this is it is not a war.

Here’s an historical corollary: “ The ethnic cleansing of Zamojszczyzna by Nazi Germany (German: Aktion Zamosc,[4] also: Operation Himmlerstadt)[5] during World War II was carried out as part of a greater plan of forcible removal of the entire Polish populations from targeted regions of occupied Poland in preparation for the state-sponsored settlement of the ethnic German Volksdeutsche.” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wi…

Right, so Germany declared war on Poland, and during their occupation of Poland during that war, they conducted genocidal activities.

I don't see how your comment refutes anything.

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#152

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:20 AM UTC

im3w1l wrote: post #136

bluish29 wrote: post #7

Someday, people in the western countries will mourn the lives lost and wish they could help in time. Except this is the time. Not after the fact and a few remains. This is an occurring theme.

I'm mourning their lives right now, but I have no idea what I could do about any of it.

[deleted]

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#153

Post by jacquesm » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:20 AM UTC

petertodd wrote: post #113

jacquesm wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they still have a future. What future would that be? The whole reason this conflict keeps going is because of faulty reasoning like this. Gazan citizens do not have a say in much of anything, they're either combatants, captives or hostages depending on what your perspective from outside Gaza is.

> What future would that be? A future where they stop killing Israeli's and slowly build up the trust to restore normal relations and trade. Gaza was given the chance when Israel decoccupied Gaza in 2005. They decided to vote in Hamas in a democratic election instead. > Gazan citizens do not have a say in much of anything, they're either combatants, captives or hostages depending on what your perspective from outside…

Between killing Rabin and the settlements this isn't going to stop for decades to come unless something changes, and for that to work both sides will need to want to solve it. I don't see that happening, and you seem to think that only Gaza citizens have the power to stop the conflict. But for that to work they'd have to have something to work with and that just isn't happening. De-occupation is clearly not sufficient to allow a nation state to be established, it needs a lot more security than that. That 6 to 8% of the entire adult male population makes it to Hamas (a figure which I can't verify but it sounds entirely believable) is a reflection of how little people in Gaza have to live for.

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#154

Post by petertodd » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:20 AM UTC

bhouston wrote: post #114

petertodd wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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> The deaths of those civilians are on Hamas, not Israel. Again, you have the language of genocide going on. Basically any deaths in Gaza no matter how they occur are at the hands of Hamas in your opinion. You do realize that you've become radicalized right?

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Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#155

Post by arp242 » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:20 AM UTC

Danidin wrote: post #105

culi wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the Health Ministry in Gaza and they've released the exact names of all 6,747 people they could account for. The UN said just 5 days ago that the figure was 5k. Given the increase in intensity 7k does not at all seem unreasonable to me https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142687

"Health Ministry in Gaza" literally the health ministry of Hamas. Why would such organization lie? /s

As I understand it, historically it's been fairly accurate and reliable. Does this guarantee they're accurate today? No. Do I blindly trust anything that's being said? No. But merely "it's Hamas, therefore the figures are false" also doesn't really cut it.

See e.g. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/26/can-we-trust-c...

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#156

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:20 AM UTC

Danidin wrote: post #105

culi wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the Health Ministry in Gaza and they've released the exact names of all 6,747 people they could account for. The UN said just 5 days ago that the figure was 5k. Given the increase in intensity 7k does not at all seem unreasonable to me https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142687

"Health Ministry in Gaza" literally the health ministry of Hamas. Why would such organization lie? /s

[deleted]

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#157

Post by jacquesm » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:21 AM UTC

orionsbelt wrote: post #148

solarpunk wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

can you elaborate?

Israel has given repeated warnings for the north of Gaza to evacuate south for the past two weeks while Gaza has had internet. In addition, they have dropped leaflets all over the are stating the same thing.

The only real problem is that there isn't anything to evacuate to and whatever they leave behind they'll lose forever.

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#158

Post by solarpunk » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:21 AM UTC

orionsbelt wrote: post #148

solarpunk wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

can you elaborate?

Israel has given repeated warnings for the north of Gaza to evacuate south for the past two weeks while Gaza has had internet. In addition, they have dropped leaflets all over the are stating the same thing.

excuse my naivete, but if they're giving two week notice about bombings, why even waste the ordinance?

Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#159

Post by YZF » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:21 AM UTC

culi wrote: post #33

Nearly all of the over 7k people killed in Gaza in the past few days are civilians. Sure Hamas, with the help of the media framing of this as a 9/11, gave them a good Casus belli, but Israel has always been good at finding Casus bellis. When Israel again invaded Gaza in 2014, they killed 2,310 people, 70% civilians and lost 67 soldiers in return. Even more destructive was the 7-10k homes completely demolished and 87k…

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Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete

#160

Post by mcpackieh » Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 1:21 AM UTC

FireBeyond wrote: post #122

petertodd wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's estimated that Hamas has between 30,000 and 40,000 soldiers(1), which is about 6% to 8% of Gaza's entire adult male population. There's no way of getting around it: if Israel finishes the job of eradicating Hamas, a large percentage of the Gazan population will be killed or captured, purely because so many of them are actively involved in Hamas. Anyway, if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they…

> Anyway, if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they still have a future. Mistakes? To be clear, before I continue further: Hamas is a terrorist organization. Hamas also has a lot of support within Palestine. Now then, scenario 1) how, realistically, do you propose that the regular non-Hamas supporting Palestinian works to eradicate Hamas? Hamas have arms. (Let's not also forget how hard right Israel…

FYI, most of what you say is true but the IDF uses the domestic Merkava, not Abrams. They have a similar "modern western MBT" aesthetic, but they're not related.