New Requirements to Travel to Europe • Hacker News Board

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#71

Post by RandomLensman » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:03 PM UTC

askonomm wrote: post #68

RandomLensman wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have done that with a lot of support from the outside and little legacy, but I guess time to cut EU net funding to Estonia now that you are winning. Germany has a very weird relationship with technology, and, yes, right now it is turning itself into a museum of sorts because change is not popular. Not sure there is winning if one side has no interest in going there, though.

Little legacy? I'm afraid you are not up to date on how hard it is to improve as an ex-soviet country with a large Russian population, many of them pro-Putin, who would do anything in their power to create corruption and prevent positive change

Little legacy tech compared to what was deployed in the West 30 years ago.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#72

Post by cogogo » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:03 PM UTC

fmobus wrote: post #58

cogogo wrote: post #43

Our children are US citizens and Spanish citizens and we live in the US. When we book flights to Spain to visit family we always use their US passport details to ensure we aren’t denied boarding returning home due to lack of an ESTA. I can already imagine the inverse and an over-zealous ticket or gate agent denying boarding to Spain because of no ETIAS and not accepting the physical Spanish passport because it’s not…

I don't think what you said in the last sentence is going to be an issue. Each check-in can be handled separately: you check-in to Spain with the Spanish passport, you check-in to the US with the American passport. There will probably be a box in the reservation system to say "I don't need ETIAS/ESTA"

I agree this would be absurd - that’s my point. But I have also heard of all kinds of bizarre things like this happening because the penalties for the airline are so high. Mostly flying Iberia there seems to be a focus on the document you show the airline matching the one in their system and you can only add one to their system.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#73

Post by snehk » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:08 PM UTC

vidanay wrote: post #65

gpas wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany recent past taught its citizens to value their privacy.

If you are referring to WW2, that was 4+ generations ago.

Not WW2 but life in East Germany, which many people remember all too well.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#74

Post by setgree » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:11 PM UTC

Teever wrote: post #50

setgree wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that the US did it first doesn’t make it reasonable. Both policies can be bad on their own terms, and either way, the costs will almost entirely be borne by people who had nothing to do with drafting the US policy in the first place.

What course of action do you suggest the EU take if not this one? What is the correct solution to this problem?

what they were doing before: nothing.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#75

Post by patrickk » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:21 PM UTC

mk89 wrote: post #49

askonomm wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well Germany isn't really considered modern by northern EU standards, as would most northern EU citizens tell you. Don't know about Austria however.

In Germany you can pay by card basically anywhere - with the phone or watch as well in most/many shops as far as I know. Not sure all this criticism makes sense (no I am not German). There are also historical reasons why Germans are concerned about the possibility of being tracked, which apparently not everyone sees the dangers of.

> In Germany you can pay by card basically anywhere - with the phone or watch as well in most/many shops as far as I know.

This simply isn't true, outside of large chains or supermarkets. Many smaller businesses like pubs, "kiosks", barbers, non-chain restaurants, and so on, are cash only.

It's a combination of tax avoidance and trying to avoid the insane level of paperwork needed for bascically every aspect of life, but especially if you have a business, no matter how small.

Source: live in Germany, near a large metro area.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#76

Post by patrickk » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:24 PM UTC

vidanay wrote: post #64

anonyfox wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but we germans also severe backwards-oriented to begin with. all kinds of esoteric garbage in daily life is shared and believed in, most things of the modern world is looked at with mistrust, and so on. the bigger/international cities like hamburg or berlin are a stark contrast however, drive like 50 miles outside of them and not much has changed during the last 100 years, except for buildings/infrastructure in gener…

When I visit Germany, I am astounded at how many of my German coworkers dislike fresh air in the office. A beautiful 25c sunny day with a nice breeze, and I opened the window near my desk. Within five minutes, someone has closed it and given me a dirty look (no, the air conditioning is not on.)

Germany is also the birthplace of homeopathy, which is why German health insurers cover this mumbo-jumbo to this day.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#77

Post by gpas » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:24 PM UTC

vidanay wrote: post #65

gpas wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany recent past taught its citizens to value their privacy.

If you are referring to WW2, that was 4+ generations ago.

Stasi was active until 1990.

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#78

Post by gerjomarty » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:37 PM UTC

As an adjunct to this, the UK, which might have joined this scheme if it was still part of the EU, is now developing its own system called the ETA (Electronic Travel Authorisation) [1]. It'll cost £10 for two years. Currently only in use for a couple of middle eastern countries, but will be rolled out more widely in the future.

[1]: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/electronic-travel-authorisation-...

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#79

Post by Teever » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:42 PM UTC

setgree wrote: post #74

Teever wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What course of action do you suggest the EU take if not this one? What is the correct solution to this problem?

what they were doing before: nothing.

Do you not view this as a problem, or do you not understand why the EU may view the status quo as a problem?

Re: New Requirements to Travel to Europe

#80

Post by slau » Mon, Oct 23, 2023, 1:44 PM UTC

mk89 wrote: post #49

askonomm wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well Germany isn't really considered modern by northern EU standards, as would most northern EU citizens tell you. Don't know about Austria however.

In Germany you can pay by card basically anywhere - with the phone or watch as well in most/many shops as far as I know. Not sure all this criticism makes sense (no I am not German). There are also historical reasons why Germans are concerned about the possibility of being tracked, which apparently not everyone sees the dangers of.

Last spring, I stopped at a nice brunch place in central Hamburg. The waitress spoke English and asked where we were from, etc. Usual touristy stuff.

When it was time to pay, we were surprised to hear only local German cards were accepted. I couldn’t use Visa, Mastercard, anything. It never occurred to them to warn us. I had to walk around for 25 minutes on the hunt for an ATM to pay my due.

What was a nice lazy Sunday morning turned into an annoying time travel back into the early 90s.