Wales' 20mph speed limit: How has the first month gone? • Hacker News Board

Re: Wales' 20mph speed limit: How has the first month gone?

#121

Post by ahahahahah » Tue, Oct 17, 2023, 6:12 PM UTC

lamontcg wrote: post #119

haspok wrote: post #22

I find it amusing how they did not interview one single person who thought he or she might just choose a different way of transportation, instead of driving a car, unless absolutely necessary. I used to commute in the north between two mid-sized cities, and any time I checked taking the car instead of the combined bike+rail travel would not have been faster, only much more inconvenient and more expensive (parking cos…

> I find it amusing how they did not interview one single person who thought he or she might just choose a different way of transportation, dropping speed limits doesn't do that. if you want netherlands, you need to invest in biking infrastructure and traffic calming. you can't just drop the speed limits and try to declare victory. > Today we have e-bikes and scooters, so hilly terrain is not a problem anymore. distr…

> > I find it amusing how they did not interview one single person who thought he or she might just choose a different way of transportation,

> dropping speed limits doesn't do that.

Why just make shit up?

Let's look at real data.

In edinburgh, after speed limits were reduced, # of people biking increased significantly. https://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/file/32217/evaluation...

In Belfast, after speed limits were reduced, traffic volume decreased significantly: https://jech.bmj.com/content/77/1/17

Re: Wales' 20mph speed limit: How has the first month gone?

#122

Post by lamontcg » Tue, Oct 17, 2023, 6:47 PM UTC

ahahahahah wrote: post #121

lamontcg wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find it amusing how they did not interview one single person who thought he or she might just choose a different way of transportation, dropping speed limits doesn't do that. if you want netherlands, you need to invest in biking infrastructure and traffic calming. you can't just drop the speed limits and try to declare victory. > Today we have e-bikes and scooters, so hilly terrain is not a problem anymore. distr…

> > I find it amusing how they did not interview one single person who thought he or she might just choose a different way of transportation, > dropping speed limits doesn't do that. Why just make shit up? Let's look at real data. In edinburgh, after speed limits were reduced, # of people biking increased significantly. https://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/file/32217/evaluation... In Belfast, after speed limits wer…

Just looking at the Edinburgh study it is almost comically bad:

> 4.5 ‘Before’ and ‘after’ surveys were also carried out at a selection of locations where the 30mph speed limit was retained. At these locations, average ‘after’ speeds in 2021 fell by 2.32mph compared with average ‘before’ speeds in 2016. This is a further decrease of 1.83mph since average ‘after’ speeds were recorded in 2019. Although many factors may have influenced this speed reduction, it could in part be attributed to the effect of speed reductions on surrounding streets, with drivers slowing their driving behaviour throughout Edinburgh.

So the "control" streets also saw a decline in average speed, and the conclusion wasn't that the primary effect was due to increasing congestion over time, but instead clearly the speed limits just magically work everywhere.

And the highest average speed on these streets was 32 mph to start with, before setting the speed limits. The roads already were doing the work there. That doesn't compare with the ~40 mph stroads we have around here that they've slapped a 25 mph sign onto and called it a day.

Re: Wales' 20mph speed limit: How has the first month gone?

#123

Post by tialaramex » Wed, Oct 18, 2023, 8:00 AM UTC

usrusr wrote: post #111

soco wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol "puffin crossing" - I like the concept, here's the link for us non-uk people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puffin_crossing

Amazing amount of effort spent on preventing the occasional superfluous vehicle stop when the pedestrian is gone for some reason. Would be surprised if the sensors did not raise a lot of false negatives for pedestrian presence, forcing them to keep begging at the knob? I wonder what drivers would have to say to lights that are always red unless they press some button and wait?

Pedestrians stop being there like all the time. Typically they cross on red, either because they saw a gap (and there's no law requiring them to wait, just politeness) or else they risked it anyway because they were impatient. Having crossed, the pedestrian no longer needs the lights so unless there's a pedestrian cycle anyway (as there may be at a junction) it should be elided.

I've literally never had to "keep begging". I believe them that the sensors exist, but the event you seem to think would happen frequently has never occurred in my experience.

Re: Wales' 20mph speed limit: How has the first month gone?

#124

Post by soco » Fri, Oct 20, 2023, 12:46 AM UTC

usrusr wrote: post #111

soco wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol "puffin crossing" - I like the concept, here's the link for us non-uk people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puffin_crossing

Amazing amount of effort spent on preventing the occasional superfluous vehicle stop when the pedestrian is gone for some reason. Would be surprised if the sensors did not raise a lot of false negatives for pedestrian presence, forcing them to keep begging at the knob? I wonder what drivers would have to say to lights that are always red unless they press some button and wait?

I've met in southern France car sensors - a metal plate on the road making the equivalent pedestrian crossing request button. As a tourist you had to be told about it.