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NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

nysenate.gov

111–120 of 138 posts

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is in the context of firearms, which are presumably modern repeating firearms, where they will cease to function if the tolerances are wrong.

You can get remarkably far with pretty crude tolerances, especially with lower pressure, pistol rounds. For example a direct-blowback, open-bolt submachine guns akin to what was used in WW2 can be pretty easily designed and built by anybody with a passable understanding of mechanics.

Again, we're talking about casting. Take a look at an Owen or a Sten and get back to me on what parts you think can be plausibly lost-PLA casted.

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#112

That amendment is so overly broad the author should be forced to re-take some sort of how to draft bills class. It would require fingerprinting for purchases of "certain 3D printers". What does that even mean? I guess the existing law defined what "firearm" means in the context of that law, but if I was a retailer selling 3D printers, I would have some serious questions about it. My 5-year-old entry level 3D printer…

It's so tiring to have these kinds of conversations with folks who do not understand the legislative process. There's no need to treat the legislator like an idiot. She's doing what EVERY legislator does, which is to identify a problem ("printed guns are a loophole in how we manage guns in this state") and saying she wants to find a solution to that problem. One mechanism by which legislators do that is by writing dr…

> There's no need to treat the legislator like an idiot. She's doing what EVERY legislator does, which is to identify a problem ("printed guns are a loophole in how we manage guns in this state") and saying she wants to find a solution to that problem. One mechanism by which legislators do that is by writing draft bills and then helping it through the legislative process to be improved

One normally researches a topic to become at least somewhat knowledgeable to put forth a somewhat reasonable solution to the identified problem. There is zero nuance in this bill. It essentially requires a background check for every 3d printer. I would find it hard to believe you could find a 3d printer that was not capable of printing a firearm component. I'm sure you could find a way to include those pens.

> sorta like how you'd write a draft essay for a college class and then go back for a second and third pass before submitting it.

I would fail a middle schooler for purposing this as a solution. A bill as simple as this one is simply zero effort or intentionally malicious.

> When you see a "ready to go bill," it's either been through a dozen-step process in this legislative session OR it's been brought up in a dozen different sessions and been improved along the way as legislators have to re-introduce all the bills they are sponsoring in each legislative session.

Any bill I've seen introduced that isn't simply looking for a participation trophy looks like there was some thought into it. This was zero thought or intentionally malicious.

> The legislator is not an expert in the issue, and I doubt she's claiming she is. She's proposing the broad strokes of a solution to a problem she sees. The point is not to pass the bill in its current form – it's to figure out how to solve the problem, using this general idea as the starting point.

Broad strokes? This is not broad strokes. Broad strokes might be only requiring it for metal 3d printers. Or have something to do with printing volume. This is about as full on nuclear as you can get without banning them. Maybe they should talk to some experts beforehand? This solution is basically the same as putting forth that everyone should stop breathing as a solution to global warming. Sure it is a "solution", but it in no way starts a productive conversation. This is nothing more than a useless political stunt and at worst an idiot/malicious legislator. Given that this is New York, I'd lean towards malicious.

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so tiring to have these kinds of conversations with folks who do not understand the legislative process. There's no need to treat the legislator like an idiot. She's doing what EVERY legislator does, which is to identify a problem ("printed guns are a loophole in how we manage guns in this state") and saying she wants to find a solution to that problem. One mechanism by which legislators do that is by writing dr…

As I understand it manufacturing your own firearms is explicitly legal in the US. This isn't a loophole, it is another politician who simply wants to disarm the working class.

>As I understand it manufacturing your own firearms is explicitly legal in the US.

In the US, yes. But maybe not in NY.

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#114
post #8
post #6

What makes a 3D printer different from a lathe or a CNC?

Good point, because without CNC, with 3d printers solely you couldn't do a firearm that do more of 1 shot. CNC are more "dangerous" for firearm production. This bill is a show of ignorance of the legislators.

[deleted]

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it manufacturing your own firearms is explicitly legal in the US. This isn't a loophole, it is another politician who simply wants to disarm the working class.

>As I understand it manufacturing your own firearms is explicitly legal in the US. In the US, yes. But maybe not in NY.

There are a lot of firearms laws in NY on paper.

To me, it seems rediculous to claim that the right to bear arms somehow excludes building one for personal use.

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#117
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Committing a crime, such as possessing a 3D printed firearm?

Where is that law applied?

https://www.nycourts.gov/judges/cji/2-PenalLaw/265/265-01(9)... https://legislation.nysenate.gov/pdf/bills/2021/S14A https://legislation.nysenate.gov/pdf/bills/2021/S13A https://www.supremecourt.gov/orders/courtorders/080823zr_dc8...

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#118
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is that law applied?

https://www.nycourts.gov/judges/cji/2-PenalLaw/265/265-01(9)... https://legislation.nysenate.gov/pdf/bills/2021/S14A https://legislation.nysenate.gov/pdf/bills/2021/S13A https://www.supremecourt.gov/orders/courtorders/080823zr_dc8...

also - my bad formatting aside, I am NOT in favor of 3D printer registration or legislation in any way.

That will be silly, counterproductive and even less impactful than having to show my license and sign an affidavit just to buy properly working cold meds in a gorram grocery store.

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#119
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's definitely not a bad time to join 3d printing industry. Much more mature than what it was even 5+ yrs ago

What is a good 3D printer?

I've had a Prusa Mk3s+ for four years. I bought the kit and assembled it. The only problem it's ever had was the result of a mistake I made during assembly, which I was able to correct. Sometimes I use it a whole bunch for a project and it gives me no trouble. Sometimes it sits untouched for six months. The moment I need it, it works.

I did modify a Ikea LACK table to sit it on to reduce vibrations. I also modified it by removing the power supply where it typically sits and placing it beneath the table. I did this because I cover my printer with a pop-up photo tent to keep heat in and enable printing in ABS. It also keeps dust from collecting on my printer.

Re: NY bill would require a criminal history check for the purchase of a 3D printer

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so tiring to have these kinds of conversations with folks who do not understand the legislative process. There's no need to treat the legislator like an idiot. She's doing what EVERY legislator does, which is to identify a problem ("printed guns are a loophole in how we manage guns in this state") and saying she wants to find a solution to that problem. One mechanism by which legislators do that is by writing dr…

Fundamentally though, the 'problem' she sees, is it really a problem? How many gun deaths in the past 10 years were related to 3d printed guns or gun parts? Is that number greater than 1% of gun deaths in the past year of the same area? (1% of gun deaths in 10yrs / 1% in 1 year) If it's not, than I would surmise that this is a non-issue nor a problem. And that instead it is a older representative that needs to retire…

I dont think NY puts the threshold at 1% of gun deaths. FWIW guns that NY defines as assault weapons are responsible for less than 1% of gun deaths and around 0% of all murders, but they still spend a disproportionate amount of effort legislating them
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