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Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

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Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#101

Post by worik »

wkat4242 wrote: post #7
doctorpangloss wrote: post #4

This comment is meant to get an interesting conversation instead of "mastercard bad" or whatever. Would the EFF feel any differently if the data were pseudo-anonymous and open to everyone? You can go to SteamDB.info and learn a lot about millions of people based on what games they buy. It's a psuedo-anonymous per-user purchase history. Here's mine: https://steamdb.info/calculator/76561197975362423/?cc=us . You can lo…

Absolutely not. Pseudo-anoymous can still be traced back with the right correlations. It should just be illegal to use customer data unless they explicitly agree. It's not even about harm. It's about having a right to privacy. And this is not some computer games we're talking about. It's our whole lives.

Yes.

But perhaps go further?

> It should just be illegal to use customer data unless they explicitly agree.

Should you be able to use customers data for any purpose whatsoever except in the delivery of goods and services that define your business?

There are edge cases, of course. But it is not edge cases that matter.

Giving permission is problematic. How do you know if you have genuine permission?

Her in New Zealand I think (IANAL) that if the other side of a major contract (like a house purchase) does not get independent legal advice then it is very difficult to enforce the contract in any way other that buy/sell.

Other conditions, idiosyncratic ones, cannot be enforced.

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#103

Post by quesera »

wolverine876 wrote: post #54
wkat4242 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the whole credit/lending part isn't even needed. In Europe this is only a marginal thing and most people just have debit cards.

There are advantages to credit. For example, the money remains in your hands until you pay your credit card bill, so if there is a dispute, fraud, or overcharge, you don't have to fight and wait to get your money back. Also, some businesses, such as car rental companies, won't provide services to debit card holders. Also, it's a free [edit: zero-interest, not free] loan (if you pay credit card bills in full); you get…

> Also, some businesses, such as car rental companies, won't provide services to debit card holders.

I think most debit cards, at least in the US, can also be authorized on the credit rails, and can therefore be used to rent cars. It's always worked for me.

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#104

Post by ClumsyPilot »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #41
causality0 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FedNow is a great step but most of the people I've asked tell me it isn't going to do anything to stop people from being debanked for "morality" reasons like sex work.

You’re only solutions for that are physical cash, crypto, gift cards, etc. The legal framework and value transfer systems are tightly coupled. Your bank isn’t going to break the law for you (maybe HSBC).

The OP us not trying to do anything illegal, he is not sending money to ISIS.

We are discussing OnlyFans and WikiLeaks, the only reason you can't pay them is because credit card bosses said so.

HSBC is a premium service, cant afford it untill you are a boss of a drug cartel

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#105

Post by fbelzile »

rozab wrote: post #76
pacifika wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something went wrong

Hilarious. Is this even working for anybody?

Since Firefox auto-filled my credit card number, I had to delete and re-type the last digit for it to work. Presumably, they have some JS looking for key up/down events to do some validation.

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#106

Post by jtbayly »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #100
ssl232 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But how do you break up such a duopoly? Start buying things with cash again.

So when I need to buy software, should I send cash by post or drive 500 miles and pay in person?

I wonder if we could convince companies to put software on some sort of portable physical medium that could be sold in brick and mortar stores?

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#107

Post by ClumsyPilot »

phyzome wrote: post #73

Use cash more. I know you can't use it everywhere, and for everything, but -- for the sake of privacy, use cash when and where you can. The cashless economy is a surveillance economy, and if you care about privacy (for others, if not for yourself) then you should use cash whenever possible.

that is not relevant, it does not help produce alternative payment system

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#108

Post by tzs »

wkat4242 wrote: post #12
reactordev wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You start an EU competing service with the top EU banks and money lenders. You build a bunch of credit card infrastructure. You tie your infrastructure to the merchant systems and get gateways to implement your protocol. Not exactly easy but it’s not impossible. An app based system could probably do it and force ApplePay and GooglePay to use it in those areas. They will if it’s in place.

Well the whole credit/lending part isn't even needed. In Europe this is only a marginal thing and most people just have debit cards.

It depends on the country [1].

[1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/968220/credit-card-owner...

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#109

Post by LgWoodenBadger »

13of40 wrote: post #17
wkat4242 wrote: post #5

We should have a payment system that isn't held hostage by two providers anyway. At least here in Europe MasterCard and visa are the only options. Amex and Discovery are really unusable here. Besides selling our data this also means we get American morals pushed on us, eg they won't provide payments for some websites they don't like. But how do you break up such a duopoly?

> American morals...they won't provide payments for some websites... Never heard of that. What are some examples?

CapitalOne told me the reason I can’t use my debit card for the Virginia state lottery, or for any of the numerous betting sites, was because of MasterCard.

Re: Mastercard Should Stop Selling Our Data

#110

Post by johnnyanmac »

ssl232 wrote: post #14
wkat4242 wrote: post #5

We should have a payment system that isn't held hostage by two providers anyway. At least here in Europe MasterCard and visa are the only options. Amex and Discovery are really unusable here. Besides selling our data this also means we get American morals pushed on us, eg they won't provide payments for some websites they don't like. But how do you break up such a duopoly?

> But how do you break up such a duopoly? Start buying things with cash again.

I'd be willing if most of the things hit weren't purely software services. It's a bit sad that Cryptocurrency has been the most common alternate payment for that and it's not in a good positions either
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