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Scrollbars are becoming a problem

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Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#561

Post by chankstein38 »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #150
codalan wrote: post #135

It's not just scrollbars. It's the elimination of window borders. Aside from not being able to differentiate one window from another similarly colored window in the background, it's nearly impossible to click and hold on anything along the edge to resize the window. It's the overloading of the title bar with so much shit like search boxes and extraneous buttons that a user has almost no place to grip to move the wind…

I am coming to the opinion that Windows XP was the maximum usable interface, and we should have stopped there [0]. But then, I might just be old and telling the kids to get off my lawn. [0] this is definitely true for Windows. All subsequent versions of Windows have had worse UX.

I swear they actually are actively trying to make the "Control Panel" / system settings experience worse with each iteration for sure. 90% of 10 and 11's system settings feel like they just took the original Control Panel screen and hid it, exposed 2-3 of the least valuable options, and displayed them in a weird solid-colored screen. To me the only way to adjust most windows settings is to find the "Advanced settings" link in the solid-colored window that will bring up the original control panels.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#562

Post by CoryAlexMartin »

Falkon1313 wrote: post #366
jorvi wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was one of the biggest powers of Mac OS X, before Electron became big. Not many companies and people developed for Mac OS X, but the ones that did pretty strongly adhered to Apple’s design guidelines, partially because it just made dev live easier and partially because your application would stick out like a sore thumb if you didn’t. At least the global menu still lives on macOS. I’m sad Gnome 3 didn’t pilfer it…

Alas, Mac is one of the biggest offenders of crappy design and anti-usability. When I first had to use one for work I thought it was buggy and defective and losing data. Turns out it was just hiding it because scrollbars were entirely hidden and disabled by default. They also hid a lot of other stuff. What kind of idiot created that design guideline? Then there's the fact that the editing keys don't work at all consi…

Mac OS 10.7 was a downward turning point. That’s when the iOSification started.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#563

Post by chankstein38 »

oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #519
DanielHB wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am thinking that most of the time you want your applications full screen with tiling been an advanced user kind of thing I myself mostly use MacOS without tilling, I just keep all my applications full screen and use multiple workspaces. I prefer to have a single big (32'' at the moment) monitor and just switch workspaces instead But if MacOS had better tilling support I would probably use it more.

> I just keep all my applications full screen and use multiple workspaces I also like this setup, but do you have a workaround for the godawful animation that MacOS uses when switching apps? I can disable the panning effect, but not the fading one.

wait how do you disable the panning effect? I hate that. I just want the workspace to switch I don't need the stupid visuals that just slow everything down.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#564

Post by kps »

nine_k wrote: post #80
f33d5173 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there's not much of a good reason to hide them. It looks nicer + you can just use the scroll wheel. A lot of the UI affordances lost over the last decade or two are unfortunate, but complaints about scroll bars seem to be purely baby duck syndrome.

It does not look nicer. It looks more mysterious. Where in the list am I? Is there anything below to scroll to? Above? To the right, everyone's favorite? And no, trying to scroll every control just to find this out is not my ideal of usability and comfort.

I recall a particular phone app controlling thermostat settings with a beautifully styled row of buttons:

   Ⓢ Ⓜ Ⓣ Ⓦ Ⓣ Ⓕ
Wednesday Thursday Friday, indeed.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#566

Post by bluGill »

f33d5173 wrote: post #172
dbetteridge wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the wrong mentality tbh Design for the best accessibility first and foremost, then try and make things look "prettier". Disabilities can affect anyone at any time and shouldn't be an afterthought.

"Accessibility" here refers to one person's very particular disability. You can't possibly predict the entire gamut of disabilities people might face. Trying to do so "first and foremost" is utter madness.

There are a number of common disabilities. Everyone starts losing near vision just after 40, which works out to almost half of the people using a computer expected lifespan is around 78, and babies don't use computers). 10% of the population is color blind of some sort. Most people will have a broken arm sometime in their life (the only statistic I can find is 6 million people in the US break their arm every year: this could also be a few clumsy people breaking their arm several times per year and most don't ever. I think most people breaking their arm at some point seems more likely)

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#567

Post by least »

abofh wrote: post #490
hulitu wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> screens are a lot brighter now aren't they. No. You just use them in the dark.

No. I suffer from an eye pigment issue, meaning bright actually hurts. Old screens don't hurt even on white. New screens physically hurt. You, however, should stay in the dark.

Does being outside generally hurt your eyes? Most complaints about brightness of screens has to do with the contrast between it and ambient lighting. When I'm in a dark room a bright screen is going to be hard to use. In a well lit room it's not an issue. It's kind of why ambient light sensing is a nice feature.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#568

Post by VoodooJuJu »

franga2000 wrote: post #321
Groxx wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... Ya know, I haven't thought about that before, but screens are a lot brighter now aren't they. I wonder how much of the dark mode thing is just that the old good defaults are now eye-burningly bright, so of course people don't like them as much.

Screens can get brighter now, but if your screen is too bright, that's entirely on you. Adjusting the brightness is trivial and you can even do it without using the buttons on the display (DDC/CI).

This is something that has always boggled my mind.

>Gee, this stark white brightness is hurting my eyes, maybe I should turn down the brightness on my display...

>Nah, I'll just demand every single company completely overhaul the CSS and contrast of everything while begrudgingly suffering the eye-burning whiteness of companies that haven't yet overhauled their CSS

Like wtf?

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#569

Post by Izkata »

barrysteve wrote: post #152
tom_ wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a longstanding abbreviation for "accessibility", along the same lines of i18n being an abbreviation for internationalisation. There's the first letter, and the last letter, and between them a count of the number of letters elidded.

Yeah English needs another vocab grouping. Greek, Latin and .

The word you're looking for is "jargon". It refers to niche-specific words that are hard for outsiders to understand, and isn't just tech-specific. "Lingo" is a much broader term.
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