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Scrollbars are becoming a problem

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Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#391

Post by albertzeyer »

codalan wrote: post #135

It's not just scrollbars. It's the elimination of window borders. Aside from not being able to differentiate one window from another similarly colored window in the background, it's nearly impossible to click and hold on anything along the edge to resize the window. It's the overloading of the title bar with so much shit like search boxes and extraneous buttons that a user has almost no place to grip to move the wind…

On Linux (e.g. KDE), you can simply Ctrl + mouse drag the window, and then click anywhere you want. This makes it even much simpler than the need of clicking on the border, even with larger borders. You actually don't need any window border at all then, or it can be full of other utilities.

There is also some software for Windows to do the same.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#392

Post by forgotmypw17 »

pseudalopex wrote: post #270
forgotmypw17 wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Active Desktop and IE Windows Explorer, for one thing. But also, generally, the difference is that Windows 95 still feels like a "workstation" computer, designed for maximum readability and clarity, while staying in the background and not drawing any attention to itself. With Windows 98, the OS begins trying to look pretty, which means having more elements and style choices which take attention away from the work.

You could turn off Active Desktop and IE Windows Explorer? And what in Windows 98 or Windows 2000 took attention away from the work?

It can be turned off, but it can't be turned off. It's still there, lurking just around the corner, and still showing up in some dialogs.

And I think this is exactly what many people's complaints are in this thread: an interface that is faulty out of the box that needs to be "tuned" in order to change it from an entertainer back into a workstation.

I haven't played with Windows 98 and Windows 2000 in a while, but I remember all sorts of "improvements" over Windows 95, such as sliding menus, "shiny" icons that draw attention to themselves, "shiny" gradient title bars, and so on.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#393

Post by pluto_modadic »

CookiesOnMyDesk wrote: post #380
rayiner wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Morons” is the right word. I don’t like to gratuitously shit on people doing their jobs. But what the hell? I can’t move a window anymore without clicking around like an idiot to figure out what’s part of the title bar and what’s a button. Every time I start “New Teams,” it asks me if I want to go back to Old Teams. If I open a PDF in New Teams from the file browser, it’s not obvious how to close the PDF without los…

>Every time I start “New Teams,” it asks me if I want to go back to Old Teams Are you sure you’re not accidentally opening the old Teams application? When you update to new Teams it leaves the old version in place so you have both, and if you open Teams with the new shortcut/application you won’t get prompted to switch back.

that's probably just MSFT's lackluster design of a chat application, though.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#395

Post by sherr »

Yes, I agree. Something that has been increasingly bothering me: how hard it is often getting to see the scrollbar, or grab it if you can find it. It's being hidden and minimised. Firefox is quite bad here, and some GTK apps. Frustrating.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#396

Post by pluto_modadic »

EGreg wrote: post #243
codalan wrote: post #135

It's not just scrollbars. It's the elimination of window borders. Aside from not being able to differentiate one window from another similarly colored window in the background, it's nearly impossible to click and hold on anything along the edge to resize the window. It's the overloading of the title bar with so much shit like search boxes and extraneous buttons that a user has almost no place to grip to move the wind…

Is it just me or is Discord super unintuitive? And Slack is becoming that way too. Telegram by contrast is a pleasure!

slack hides their settings in absolutely awful places

teams is constantly broken on linux

discord's ACL system is... a mess.

meanwhile IRC clients are brutalistic and painful to look at (or really any open source chat app)

nobody (commercial or open source) has an incentive to make a truly intuitive app that doesn't screw the user or ignore their needs.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#397

Post by pluto_modadic »

fodkodrasz wrote: post #332
EGreg wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it just me or is Discord super unintuitive? And Slack is becoming that way too. Telegram by contrast is a pleasure!

Unfortunately Telegram is getting more and more useless gimmick anti-features. It was better 3-5 years ago, when it didn't have so much useless junk. Still the most streamlined experience. While voice and video calls, screen sharing is nice, they are not very polished, good quality, and UI is overloaded, but the last useful feature additions. (useless junk: animated stickers, custom wallpapers, emoji responses (thoug…

I like telegram's slick UI library. making an app using it would be nice.

That and stickers, reaction emojis (which I also like in Slack, and teams only lets you have one reaction)

calls, video, screen sharing, animated stickers, premium-stuff however... all junk.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#398

Post by graycat »

6510 wrote: post #311
graycat wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Along these lines, recently happened to see at the Web site "Big Red Car" https://themusingsofthebigredcar.com/returns-driving-retail/... Edit: Somehow this URL leads to some spot on the Web page of the URL but does not always lead to the actual post. To find the post on that Web page, the post starts with "To me, all of retailing has one"

I've figured it out! You have to open their disquss profile, ctrl+f search for "to me, a" then click on the "7 comments" part of "Discussion on Littlefield Advisors 7 comments" then ctrl+f search for "to me, a" again and there you click on the ".. days ago" link under the username. https://disqus.com/home/discussion/littlefieldadvisors/retur... Now everyone can bookmark it, or print it and glue it to the wall. edit:…

Thanks! Uh, in this thread here at Hacker News we were, uh, considering, uh, "user interface"???? Yup!

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#399

Post by raspyberr »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #381
BLKNSLVR wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That title bar thing, good god damn. I have to concentrate my vision on the title bar to place my fucking cursor between non-outlined active sections just to grab that motherfucker and shove it over. It is entirely a user experience regression. There's no benefit gained, whatsoever, from moving content to the title bar. Easily moving a window by dragging the title bar was something that "just worked" for at least two…

> There's no benefit gained, whatsoever, from moving content to the title bar The one benefit I can see is to gain some extra vertical space on the skinny 16:9 screens, especially now that the task bar in windows 11 got thicker and can no longer be moved to a side. They, of course, still haven't gotten around to fixing the auto-hide behavior, so that's still not an option. The rare times I have to use windows, I use…

You can't actually use reason to understand modern UX/UI designers choices. I've just got Windows 11 at work. They've increased the blank space between all the items in the file exporer quite significantly. They clearly don't care about vertical space because I know have to scroll first in places I could click first before.

Re: Scrollbars are becoming a problem

#400

Post by hulitu »

f33d5173 wrote: post #55
jwells89 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the context of the original iPhone at least, hiding the scrollbar when not scrolling makes some amount of sense… when your screen is 3.5" in size and your goal is to render content with "desktop" fidelity, there's not a whole lot of room for a scrollbar, plus most people aren't going to be interacting with the scrollbar. For desktop OSes where the smallest screen being used is much larger on the other hand there's…

> there's not much of a good reason to hide them. It looks nicer + you can just use the scroll wheel. A lot of the UI affordances lost over the last decade or two are unfortunate, but complaints about scroll bars seem to be purely baby duck syndrome.

> It looks nicer + you can just use the scroll wheel.

"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". My work laptop does not have a "scroll wheel". There is a posibility to scroll using the touch pad but it is undocumented and hit or miss.

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