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Awareness at Death

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Re: Awareness at Death

#71

Post by _nalply »

Out-of-body experiences are real. My wife had one. Because of special circumstances I am convinced that she didn't know about them. It was an unknown and completely new thing for her. When I told her that some people also experienced out-of-body, she was stunned.

I came to the realisation that science has limits. I have the hypothesis that the set of measurable effects is smaller than the set of all true things.

In other words: Scientific experiments about some things are inconclusive or just limited to what is scientifically measurable. The world is larger than that.

Re: Awareness at Death

#73

Post by cypherpunks01 »

ramenmeal wrote: post #20
cypherpunks01 wrote: post #16

I feel like I'm missing something with the purpose of the recall accuracy study. > Third, the study enabled an unprecedented objective test of survivors’ recall accuracy. Many have wondered: Have those who recall death experiences—even of happenings during the resuscitation—experienced hallucinations, such as commonly reported with oxygen deprivation or psychedelic drugs? Or are their out-of-body reports of cardiac a…

I had the same question. I assume this was to test if the following experience was based on real events, or imagined. > “I was high up in the ceiling of the ward looking down upon the bed.” “I could see the doctors and nurses working over me.” “I perceived and saw everything around me, like in 360 degrees.”

I perceived and saw everything around me, except for the banana! : )

Re: Awareness at Death

#74

Post by Nextgrid »

MilStdJunkie wrote: post #31

"It's like a labyrinth you can't see, innit? And by the time - heeheehee, by the time, heehee - by the time - you can see it, it's too late. There's no way out"[1] The phrase "invisible labyrinth" describes perfectly the relationship of the self inside the complexity of the human brain. When the body tries, in drips and drops, to save the organism, parts of the resource-hungry labyrinth are taken apart like a travell…

> you get an emergent evolutionary impulse to maintain internal narrative.

I suppose it's just an implementation detail that it works for near-death experiences?

I can't see it being "intentionally" evolved, first because a large (most?) number of NDEs actually make people less afraid of death (which evolution should technically be selecting against), and also because until modern medicine/resuscitation, the NDE behavior was very unlikely to change the evolutionary outcome of an individual since if they get into a stage when they're having an NDE, actual death would always follow, thus the evolutionary fate of the individual is already sealed.

Re: Awareness at Death

#75

Post by etrautmann »

_nalply wrote: post #71

Out-of-body experiences are real. My wife had one. Because of special circumstances I am convinced that she didn't know about them. It was an unknown and completely new thing for her. When I told her that some people also experienced out-of-body, she was stunned. I came to the realisation that science has limits. I have the hypothesis that the set of measurable effects is smaller than the set of all true things. In o…

To prove your point, in an almost trivial sense, there are things we seem to be unable to study effectively, like nutrition. In principle it could be studied but in practice it's nearly impossible.

I think you're making the bigger point though that there are things that we might not be able to study at all, which I'm not sure I agree is well grounded, despite it seeming impossible given current methods.

Re: Awareness at Death

#76

Post by wessorh »

At the end of 2022 I caught Legionaries and arrived at the hospital with 48% O2 saturation and promptly slipped into a coma. Next came a trake and a respirator which was placed in a medically induced coma. I was unconscious for almost 2 months in the ER. I'd get CPR twice and once I awoke fully the head nurse came in and asked (once I could talk) how it was to meet Jesus. I didn't meet Jesus but I did hang with several dead friends, some aliens and at least one deity. The dreams were most vivid and I now look at death as a physical phenomena, I do believe that my spirit persists. I'm glad that I get to continue with this life and I'm grateful for all the days, good or bad. The "dreams" were 90% dark/bad but having survived those makes today just wonderful.

Re: Awareness at Death

#77

Post by MPSimmons »

just_1_comment wrote: post #64
MPSimmons wrote: post #40

In January, 2022, I experienced a 100% blockage of my Left Anterior Descending artery (a "widowmaker" heart attack), and I experienced cardiac arrest for a minute or two while on the exam table in a local emergency room. CPR was administered, and I was shocked back into rhythm, whereupon I regained consciousness immediately. During the time I was dead, I have a memory. It is a singular experience of non-existence. Ev…

I was present when someone else went through the same experience but they reacted slightly differently than you did…”Please don’t stop CPR! There’s nothing there! Whenever you stop and I die, it’s all black!” His last horrified words were “There’s nothing there!”

wow, that's really unfortunate for him. I don't know why I reacted so positively when he reacted so negatively, but I didn't find it disturbing at all. It was a palpable feeling of being "okay" for me.

I take it that person didn't make it?

Re: Awareness at Death

#78

Post by mrtksn »

MPSimmons wrote: post #40

In January, 2022, I experienced a 100% blockage of my Left Anterior Descending artery (a "widowmaker" heart attack), and I experienced cardiac arrest for a minute or two while on the exam table in a local emergency room. CPR was administered, and I was shocked back into rhythm, whereupon I regained consciousness immediately. During the time I was dead, I have a memory. It is a singular experience of non-existence. Ev…

> During the time I was dead

Thanks for sharing. Very interesting experience however, I don’t think that you were dead. IMHO, you were in a state where your brain was not functioning properly due to lack of blood flow or maybe external input.

All death experiences seem to be something of that sort and I suspect if body transplant was a thing, the experience would have been similar.

I think the correct description of the experience would be pre-death or something similar and would not be a glimpse into the “life beyond death”.

Re: Awareness at Death

#79

Post by duncancarroll »

I've had a couple OBEs (as a result of meditation, not near-death), and they're very interesting, but I'm not surprised that Parnia's subjects weren't able to match up any images because I've never had an OBE where the objective world is completely accurate. It's odd because you'll be totally lucid, often more so than in waking life, but things are slightly off, and electronics in particular never seem to work.

I've had OBEs where I can remember any aspect of my life from any time period, in exact, incredible detail, just as if it had all been recorded and was being played back on a gigantic IMAX. Smells, tastes, sounds, thoughts, everything, with no impediment to recall. Every memory was instantly available as soon as I thought of it. It was like I'd just taken off a heavy lead raincoat I'd been wearing all my life, and now there was nothing to impede thought or movement.

In another, more mundane experience, I had just OBE'd and was trying to lift my arm out of my body. As I did so, my watch's vibrating alarm went off, so I grabbed my arm and tried to turn it off (it only has two buttons and pressing either will turn it off.) I could feel the buttons, but as I pressed them it did nothing. Then I realized, of course, that I wasn't grabbing my real arm. So I laid back down, snapped back into my body, opened my eyes and turned off the real watch.

I was surprised b/c it had never occurred to me that something as insignificant as my wristwatch would come with me into the OBE state, nor that I would be able to feel it and manipulate it exactly like the real thing. It made me think how in ancient Egypt the dead would be buried with everything they needed to take with them to the afterlife. Food for thought.

Re: Awareness at Death

#80

Post by _nalply »

etrautmann wrote: post #75
_nalply wrote: post #71

Out-of-body experiences are real. My wife had one. Because of special circumstances I am convinced that she didn't know about them. It was an unknown and completely new thing for her. When I told her that some people also experienced out-of-body, she was stunned. I came to the realisation that science has limits. I have the hypothesis that the set of measurable effects is smaller than the set of all true things. In o…

To prove your point, in an almost trivial sense, there are things we seem to be unable to study effectively, like nutrition. In principle it could be studied but in practice it's nearly impossible. I think you're making the bigger point though that there are things that we might not be able to study at all, which I'm not sure I agree is well grounded, despite it seeming impossible given current methods.

We can study it, but won't get scientific results.
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