Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

thedrive.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

621–630 of 635 posts

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#621

Post by earthling8118 »

high_priest wrote: post #285
whoknowsidont wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The positive externalities are even more enormous What do cars specifically positively provide? NOT including the positives that exists due to constructing infrastructure around that mode of transportation (artificial issues).

I am a person that has actively chosen to live without a car, despite work in automotive industry. Recently I wanted to take my vintage computer in a large crate, to a LAN meeting, but I would not be able to transport it without a car. Which forced me to order a taxi, which is a car for hire... I maybe could have been fine with a cargo bike, but it would not be satisyingly safe for me or the cargo. I have also heard…

How is having to move something a problem? Nobody is saying they never have a place. But is it reasonable for you to purchase, maintain, and store a large expensive object that pollutes just for some moving? No. It's better to have a system that helps you when needed but doesn't produce as much waste per person. The taxi isn't a problem.

What do you mean by crashproof car? Those words don't go together. Even a little.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#622

Post by jayd16 »

bmitc wrote: post #405
jayd16 wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not moving You mean like at a stop light or even a stop sign? A very common thing to be near in a city?

You mean when other cars are still moving? And what is your point, in general? Engines make noise. That's not under dispute.

Unless you're on the far corner, you're only living by one side of the road. Hearing ICE engines rev up to accelerate from a light is a non-trivial amount of noise.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#623

Post by jayd16 »

somerandomqaguy wrote: post #508
adrianN wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EVs are significantly less noisy on residential streets though. You know, where people live.

Only below 18mph or 30kph. > As required by the PSEA, (1) this rule proposes to establish FMVSS No.141, Minimum Sound Requirements for Hybrid and Electric Vehicles, which would require [quiet vehicles] to produce sounds meeting the requirements of this standard. This proposed standard applies to EVs and to those HVs that are capable of propulsion in any forward or reverse gear without the vehicle's ICE operating. The…

So the 405 will finally be whisper quiet.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#624

Post by bedobi »

bequanna wrote: post #616
bedobi wrote: post #568

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not what we’re saying though, all we’re saying is let’s get serious about alternatives to driving, the rest will follow. And yeah the die hards who will never give up their car, fine, but they better be prepared to pay the price for the externalities they generate, which isn’t the case currently. I also think it’s funny you think it’s us who are trying to force people to retreat from society. The single family…

Dude, if you think pretty much everyone else in the US is wrong except you and your fringe group, I’d reevaluate your position.

Well, in this case, everyone else is wrong. The environment and society cannot bear the level of automobile dependency North America has. If we want to leave a livable planet and society for the future, it has to end. But you’re right, we cannot and should not do anything about it, because that would infringe on motorists right to drive. After all, what’s more important, not inconveniencing motorists or the planet?

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#625

Post by bedobi »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #619
anlsh wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. But we're talking about cars, not computers, and their novelty is just one among many strong pieces of evidence that a much less car-dependent society is possible, even desirable. Perhaps you can refute the existence billions of people on the planet who live without commuting via car, or the dense networks of public transit which they often rely on?

> Perhaps you can refute the existence billions of people on the planet who live without commuting via car, or the dense networks of public transit which they often rely on? You have to remember that the infrastructure they depend on to have drinkable water, stores with food on shelves, power and other media, itself is built around cars and trucks, and depends on them being available and able to drive everywhere. Car…

It’s funny because you’re actually arguing against yourself. Those of us who want to reduce car dependency think exactly that: the use of cars, trucks and roads should be reserved for the less able, the elderly, delivery and emergency vehicles etc. Everyone else who don’t need to be there shouldn’t be. Imagine how much easier and safer everyone’s life would be if roads weren’t gridlocked by the countless million people making unnecessary trips in single occupant automobiles who don’t need to.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#626

Post by cutemonster »

sokoloff wrote: post #335
bmitc wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This sentiment is just contrarianism, I think. I really don't think it is. We're thrusting ourselves into just new problems. Yes, we move away from old problems that gas-powered cars have, but we move into new problems. For one, EVs perpetuate the idea of the car, which is perhaps the most dangerous part. Then, there's all sorts of new things like building out the infrastructure required for EVs and mining the new…

Cars are selling, despite their high economic price, because they're incredibly useful . Make competing modes of transit at least one of more useful at no more cost or no less utility but at a lower cost and people will switch incredibly quickly. That's a tall order, because the modern automobile is a wonder of transport speed, comfort, and convenience.

> Cars ... incredibly useful

Not where I live, in north western Europe. Here the subways are fast, and not many use cars inside the city. Many buses and bike lanes too.

Here, cars are slow: traffic queues, finding a parking lot. But the subway never runs into any traffic queues.

And the subway is many times cheaper than a car's monthly cost. And I can read HN on the subway

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#627

Post by mushbino »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #572
mushbino wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived near 880 in Oakland and always had massive amounts of this super fine sticky dust. They call that 880 corridor cancer corridor. My friends who lived next door who I was renting from, their son got leukemia and they think that had something to do with it.

That sounds like a really easy thing to study. (Does living near a highway significantly increase risk of cancer?) A single anecdote like that isn't very convincing.

Here's a study done from 1990 to 2010. It shows a statistically significant increase in cancer.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4772211/

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#628

Post by ehnto »

teo_zero wrote: post #523
ehnto wrote: post #445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no trouble hearing EVs approaching, they sound identical to modern ICE, which is to say 90% road noise. Some ICE cars are noisier by choice of course but modern commuter cars are very quiet at the exhaust typically, the road noise is the dominant noise. I have cars driving past me at about 50kph right now, I am barely hearing the engine for about 3 seconds or less as it passes, and the road noise continues to…

Driving both a gasoline car and an EV, I can surely tell you that pedestrians get out of the way when I approach with the former much more often than with the latter. So they are no identical. Of course where I live there's no law-mandated minimum noise level for EVs.

We might end up in the weeds here, but I imagine you are meaning when moving relatively slowly? I hope pedestrians aren't in need of moving out of the way of your driving over 25kmph!

Indeed at slow speeds EVs are quieter. That probably does make a difference for inner city traffic, which is also where you really want less tailpipe emissions, EVs help there too.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#629

Post by s3p »

Gigachad wrote: post #470
koolba wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's always this circular logic where "I need my car because the supermarket is an hour walk" but the supermarket is an hour walk because everyone drives. If there’s no roads and vehicles, how does the food get to the supermarket?

There's a huge gap between "literally no roads or vehicles of any kind" and "I have to use my car to get anywhere". These bad faith arguments are tiring.

You propose no alternative. You can't have cars if you have no roads. You can't have roads without cars, because you need to figure out how things are going to get to that supermarket.

Re: Tire dust makes up the majority of ocean microplastics

#630

Post by aperson_hello »

matsemann wrote: post #528
aperson_hello wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Decarbonization will have negative externalities. Yes, even environmental ones. I'd argue that those externalities are necessary and delay to mitigate them is going to be worse than fixing them later.

The point is that reducing car usage / dependency would solve both. Just switching to EVs doesn't really solve that much, except it saves the car industry.

Good luck rebuilding all of our built infrastructure in the next two decades to reduce car dependency in time to meet decarbonization goals...
Post reply on HN