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Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

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Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#281

Post by Propelloni »

scarface_74 wrote: post #132
idiotsecant wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mandating open standards is not the same thing as 'making consumer experience worse'.

So everything that any company designs should go through a committee before it’s introduced and become parts of a standards body?

That is your benevolent interpretation of the post you are answering to? Or is this just your hyperbolic example of the black-and-white fallacy to show how not to conduct a civil discussion?

I know, the point you are trying to make is buried beneath somewhere but it is really hard to make out. All I see is pettiness. So sad.

Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#282

Post by midoridensha »

TheRealPomax wrote: post #28
loup-vaillant wrote: post #10

They don't necessarily have to: there's another, more comprehensive hammer they (or the US for that matter) could use: disallow vertical integration. Force hardware vendors to only sell hardware. If any software that can be changed remotely or by the user is off limits. Even firmware. Conversely, software vendors can only sell (or freely distribute) software. For vendors from abroad, don't go extra-territorial, just…

rather than "disallow vertical integration", start with "disallow lock-out". By all means, vertically integrate as much as you want but it should not be illegal for someone to take your hardware and use it for another purpose that you have no say in, or write and run software using your hardware without you having a say in that.

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Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#283

Post by midoridensha »

chme wrote: post #60
loup-vaillant wrote: post #10

They don't necessarily have to: there's another, more comprehensive hammer they (or the US for that matter) could use: disallow vertical integration. Force hardware vendors to only sell hardware. If any software that can be changed remotely or by the user is off limits. Even firmware. Conversely, software vendors can only sell (or freely distribute) software. For vendors from abroad, don't go extra-territorial, just…

I get you in principle, but the company should still be allowed to sell hardware with some default software installed, because if I had to search for someone on the internet that wrote software for my specific smart TV, washing machine or whatever this becomes much more painful. I would rather see a 'right to repair' extended to software bundled. Any device or software that can connect to a network or can be interfac…

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Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#284

Post by pjmlp »

PrimeMcFly wrote: post #218
scarface_74 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there one Windows laptop that can get 14 hours of battery life, fanless and that runs at a decent speed?

There are windows laptops that advertise over 20 hours of battery life with top current or last gen Intel and AMD processors.

I rather have Windows laptops that can replace a graphics workstation. a gaming PC on the go, or HPC on the go.

Markets Apple decided weren't worth their time.

Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#285

Post by PrimeMcFly »

pjmlp wrote: post #284
PrimeMcFly wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are windows laptops that advertise over 20 hours of battery life with top current or last gen Intel and AMD processors.

I rather have Windows laptops that can replace a graphics workstation. a gaming PC on the go, or HPC on the go. Markets Apple decided weren't worth their time.

It's amazing how many people are just loyal to Apple even when it doesn't make sense.

There was a time when PCs started having vastly better graphics cards, and Adobe started prioritizing development for PCs, but still graphic designers were buying Apple because 'it's what creatives use'.

Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#287

Post by devinprater »

I can get behind this. It'd definitely be great to see VoiceOver, the screen reader on Mac, get some competition. Maybe then blind Mac users could do their work on Mac, even in Salesforce and Google Docs and Sheets and such, and not hear "Safari not responding" at the slightest sign of overused JavaScript. There's a reason most blind people either use Windows, or don't use a desktop or laptop at all.

Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#288

Post by webmobdev »

Jtsummers wrote: post #103
webmobdev wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't - it only needs to support open standards.

What open standard covers shared clipboards across devices?

If it doesn't exist, then obviously the standard body has to work with the stakeholders and create one.

Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#289

Post by webmobdev »

krick wrote: post #126
webmobdev wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> * How will it make my everyday experience better as an Apple customer without the integration of software and hardware between my Mac, iPads Watch, Airpods and phone?* "Open Standards" - There is no reason that your Mac or iPhone should only work with other Apple products through closed and proprietary standards. With adoption of open standards, all devices (irrespective of their manufacturer) can offer a decent in…

It is a great idea, but with a caveat: communism is a great idea too, and pretty much in the same sense. I can say that about most of the propositions in this thread. I, as a user (and a vim-user, may I add), would like it very much if all the software and hardware in the world would be fully open, customizable, community-maintained. I, as a manufacturer, am less keen on that idea. So, to make it happen, every manufa…

> ... literally, we are stepping farther from the open market and killing some personal freedom...

No, we are democratically balancing consumer rights with the rights of entrepreneurs to make money. Consumers need the right to repair and not be limited with closed, proprietary standards. That entrepreneurs may take take a slight hit on their profit due to this is acceptable as protecting the consumer enhances the well being of the overall society that both entrepreneurs and the consumers are part of. (And note that right to repair and open standards can also foster more competition in the "free market" and reduce monopolistic abuses - so it is really a win-win for both sides).

Re: Could EU force hardware manufacturers to make working drivers for Linux?

#290

Post by abenga »

askonomm wrote: post #279
abenga wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It obviously uses "a program, a hack, or configuration" (taking these from the original reply), just that they are written and pre-installed by Apple, and work seamlessly.

But from the end-user perspective it doesn't really. Nobody consciously sets the universal clipboard up, it comes as part of the cohesive whole of the Apple ecosystem. That's my point. Whether or not you want to dive deep into nerdland of if it's a program or not is besides the point, because for the end-user none of it matters, and that's why the vertical integration is nice.

Probably true. The whole vertical integration does rub me the wrong way though, it's just uncomfortable to have one company own so much of my personal computing infrastructure, especially one that is so unfriendly to "tinkerers" like me.
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