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What Is the Future of the DAW?

djmag.com

181–190 of 223 posts

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#181

The Future of the DAW is DAW-less. A Synthstrom Deluge, a humble Eurorack (morphagene!) and a microFreak .. A Zynthian! Holy molies, live Zynthian compositions are binoculars! 1010music Bluebox+Blackbox. SonicWARE SmplTek. Monome. Oh dear, monome is a hell of a platform for next-generation DAW tomfoolery! Notice a pattern? Its the hardware . You can no longer call it a workstation when, after all, it behaves like an…

Let us know about the utility of those (excellent) tools for:

* a four part acapella group

* a traditional western european orchestra

* someone who wants a recording of the call to prayer

* anyone who needs to make a recording of anything at all?

The original purpose of DAWs like ProTools was recording, editing and mixing. Composition and instrumental performance crept in later. Even if that aspect were to be completely replaced by hardware (possible, but unlikely), it would leave the original DAW functionality just as in in demand.

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#182
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really??? Uh, it's probably my fault but as a hobbyist composer (day job software engineer) I can personally say that tools I use absolutely and utterly suck. They're immensely buggy. My workflow includes: - LilyPond for writing the final notation - MuseScore 4 for playing around, MuseScore 3 for playing MIDI - REAPER as DAW, SFZ plugin for midi soundfonts - Audacity for processing WAV files - music21 python lib if I…

> Linux audio processing Just use Windows and all of these problems go away. When I make music my stack is basically Ableton Live, NI Komplete and Spitfire Audio and I have exactly 0 of these issues.

Look at his nickname…

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#183

Ooh, this is an interesting set of comments. I'm currently trying to turn a really old Midimam Keystation 61 into a toy synth for my 3x 10 year old nephews (triplets). I'm using a spare Raspberry pi 4 so it's all gonna be Linux based. But I actually want to make it completely headless because DAWs are too complex and, IMHO, get between the person and the noises they're making. My goal is to hook up a Korg nanoKONTROL…

I use an RPi4 as the sound generator for the fully weighted 88 key controller my wife plays at home. It runs just one synth - the proprietary physical modelling synth Pianoteq, available for linux, windows, macOS, x86_64 and ARM. It does have a 10" touch screen because the synth has parameters worth controlling (e.g. what piano model). No DAW complexity, but I don't see why you'd ever get a DAW involved with "a toy synth for my 3x 10 year old nephews". It was a little tricky to get the sdcard set up initially, but since I did, it's just power-on-and-play-it.

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#184
post #162

I am a musician that mainly plays guitar and synths. I have a large eurorack, have tried nearly every MPE compatible synth & controller, and have a massive pedal board. I am also an embedded software engineer and have made audio plugins for VCV Rack. I have written blog posts [0] about MIDI to try to explain it to a technical-ish audience. I have written many, many more posts about why the way we interact with comput…

> On my site, I have a list of DAWs and a simple Pro/Con view of each

You reviewed three DAWs. Glad you put the link to Admiral Bumblebee's page on yours, because that's actually "a list of DAWs".

Re: MIDI - you can already "play between the notes" using either MTS or even just simple pitch bend - the issue with the latter is building a controller that makes this better than the wheel on most keyboards, the issue with the former is finding synths that understand MTS and use it.

> no good method for hardware acceleration is a limiting factor in the audio world

DSP processors have been available for this since before ProTools, which was fundamentally based on hardware acceleration. In the present era, UAD and others continue (for now) to carry that torch, but the principle problem is that during the period where Moore's Law applied to processor speed, actual DSP could not keep up with generic CPUs (every DSP system was the speed of 1 or 2 generations ahead of generic CPUs). Current generic processors are now so fast that for time domain processing, there's really no need for DSP hardware - you just need a bigger multicore processor if you're running into limits (mostly - there are some exceptions, but DSP hardware wouldn't fix most of them either).

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#185
post #162

I am a musician that mainly plays guitar and synths. I have a large eurorack, have tried nearly every MPE compatible synth & controller, and have a massive pedal board. I am also an embedded software engineer and have made audio plugins for VCV Rack. I have written blog posts [0] about MIDI to try to explain it to a technical-ish audience. I have written many, many more posts about why the way we interact with comput…

I can't agree more with this post! As a middle eastern producer trying to incorporate maqam, the workflow is custom...and frustrating...and funnily still better on a workstation. And CV control is not viable as a control for acoustic sampled vsts. Your opguide site looks like an incredible resource, thank you for creating it!

I'm the lead author of Ardour [0], and I'd very much like to hear more about your frustrations, since over the next 1-2 years, paying attention to non-European musical culture is one of the things I hope to focus on during development. You can reach me via the email address in my profile, or maybe use our forums at discourse.ardour.org. Thanks.

[0] https://ardour.org/ <= a cross-platform open source DAW that has been around for more than 23 years

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#186
post #162

I am a musician that mainly plays guitar and synths. I have a large eurorack, have tried nearly every MPE compatible synth & controller, and have a massive pedal board. I am also an embedded software engineer and have made audio plugins for VCV Rack. I have written blog posts [0] about MIDI to try to explain it to a technical-ish audience. I have written many, many more posts about why the way we interact with comput…

> On my site, I have a list of DAWs and a simple Pro/Con view of each You reviewed three DAWs. Glad you put the link to Admiral Bumblebee's page on yours, because that's actually "a list of DAWs". Re: MIDI - you can already "play between the notes" using either MTS or even just simple pitch bend - the issue with the latter is building a controller that makes this better than the wheel on most keyboards, the issue wit…

> You reviewed three DAWs.

There's definitely more than 3 reviewed there? Sure, a lot of them still say [TODO] on getting a review, but then I don't want to review something I don't have a significant amount of 1-on-1 time with. Maybe you didn't realize there are click-able tabs?

Also, the way you phrased this came off as quite rude. There is someone on the other side of the screen, and you'd do well to consider that in the future.

> Re: MIDI - you can already "play between the notes" using either MTS or even just simple pitch bend [...]

Pitchbend is global to the track, if you play a chord and bend, all of the notes bend equally. With MPE it is possible to bend a single note, but then MPE isn't supported in every DAW (FL Studio doesn't have it) and my gripes with MTS are explained already: You're still working with only 127 possible notes so you limit your octave range. Worse, with all of the microtonal solutions, the UI will still typically look like a 12-tone piano. This is sort of okay for 24TET, but It's immensely confusing for anything else.

> DSP processors [...]

They really haven't been true for audio for a while now. Moore's law isn't dead, but definitionally "Moore's law is the observation that the number of transistors in an integrated circuit (IC) doubles about every two years" doesn't equate to all work loads seeing an improvement. Audio is a pretty latency sensitive, mostly strictly sequential workload. Making audio code that uses multiple cores often isn't even possible. Audio needs clock speed and IPC gains, which we have gotten, but that's not always enough. I have a 5900x and still hit limits. What would you recommend I do, get a Threadripper or Xeon so that I can have even more cores sit idle when making music? If anything, the extra cores have been a hindrance lately - on my 3900x I had before at high loads I had to pin the processes to one chiplet or I'd me more likely to get buffer underruns. It's not as if anyone is arguing that CPUs getting faster so quickly means that we don't need graphic cards.

UAD exists but then you're limited to their plugins and their accelerators are quite expensive for not being really all that powerful. I'm also not convinced that kind of accelerator is even the right approach. Field Programmable Analog Arrays, FPAAs, for example, could be setup with a DAC and ADC on either end. Or we could make DAWs/OSs capable of handling digitally connected analog "plugins" better - think effects like the Big Muff Pi Hardware Plugin [1] or Digitakt with Overbridge [2] (These are the only two examples I know of!). Using the word "Acceleration" was wrong, what I really meant is offloading. We need a way to offload the grunt work to something we can easily add more of or better fits the task. I think this is particularly true of distortions, as slamming the CPU with 4 or 8x oversampling to get a distortion to not sound awful hurts.

[1] https://www.ehx.com/products/big-muff-pi-hardware-plugin/ [2] https://www.elektron.se/us/overbridge

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#187
post #162

I am a musician that mainly plays guitar and synths. I have a large eurorack, have tried nearly every MPE compatible synth & controller, and have a massive pedal board. I am also an embedded software engineer and have made audio plugins for VCV Rack. I have written blog posts [0] about MIDI to try to explain it to a technical-ish audience. I have written many, many more posts about why the way we interact with comput…

I can't agree more with this post! As a middle eastern producer trying to incorporate maqam, the workflow is custom...and frustrating...and funnily still better on a workstation. And CV control is not viable as a control for acoustic sampled vsts. Your opguide site looks like an incredible resource, thank you for creating it!

I've been going down the rabbit hole of using all physically modeled synths instead of sample based VSTs so that I can fully take advantage of MPE controls instead of trying to get samples to be expressive though arcane incantations of key twidding in Kontakt. I think it's probably the best option for doing things in a DAW right now, unfortunately.

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#189
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PreSonus Studio One has what you're describing. Im switching from logic pro to a new DAW and so far studio one has the most of my boxes checked.

What does it do that you prefer?

It runs on window, is not a subscription service, has a lot functions that I'm used to and has a lot of automated workflow possibilities. Theres a lot more it can do then I'm able to mention but here are some of the cool traits that stood out for me. It can group a chord progression and create a variety for multiple tracks without getting into the midi editor. Additionally, I can globally save those chords and use them down the line in any other project easily. Theres a lyrics function too where I can run parallel to a vocal track so the vocalist can pick up exactly where they need to and see what's coming. I've done a few demo projects and I really like it so far.

Re: What Is the Future of the DAW?

#190

To be honest, I really like existing tools and workflows and I don't really want that to change. > Open a DAW from the year 2000 and it’s highly likely you’ll recognise the vast majority of the features — both functionally and visually — from any DAW you might use today. This assertion that "old is bad" really, really needs to die. Change for the sake of change is bad. I don't see why all these new innovations can't…

Really??? Uh, it's probably my fault but as a hobbyist composer (day job software engineer) I can personally say that tools I use absolutely and utterly suck. They're immensely buggy. My workflow includes: - LilyPond for writing the final notation - MuseScore 4 for playing around, MuseScore 3 for playing MIDI - REAPER as DAW, SFZ plugin for midi soundfonts - Audacity for processing WAV files - music21 python lib if I…

What are some Lily bugs you've encountered?
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