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How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

bbc.com

81–90 of 103 posts

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minor nitpick: when you provide figures in the multiple thousands, it really improves readability if you use the thousand separator (40000 -> 40,000, and even more so 100000 -> 100,000). Thanks.

To be fair in many parts of the world 40000 and 100000 is written like this 40.000 and 100.000. So it may confuse non Americans.

Let's use Python unambiguous notation with underscores 100_000 or 40_000.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#82

I had to get a colonoscopy and be awake for the whole thing. They gave me fentanyl (my first and only time ever experiencing this drug) for the procedure. I have very fond memories of the entire experience, which is extremely disconcerting considering what was going on at the time. This drug probably shouldn’t exist imho.

Shit, I once got a colonoscopy in the UK's NHS without sedatives nor opioids.

It freaking hurt a lot which apparently shouldn't have. That gave doctors the clue that I had IBS and a very sensitive colon apparently (I didn't have anything wrong from what they saw).

All future colonoscopies I've had, I demand to get knocked out. Better for everyone haha

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#83
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not exactly. But generally making less harmful drugs legal would help - generally the more prohibition the stronger the drugs become.

Making all drugs legal to use makes sense to me. Criminalizing users only makes things worse. But make it illegal to sell, transport, possess in large quantities etc.

The problem I see with criminalizing drugs (including sell, posses and transport) is that drug addicts and abuse is mainly a health issue.

There's an underlying reason why those people start consuming that shit. Same as with sugar/obesity/diabetes here in Mexico.

Once you make it ilegal, suddenly you created a criminal issue. You've created another problem for yourself and split your resources to fight both problems now.

I would rather prefer government/society focus only in the underlying health issue. And disappear the criminal issue by making it 100% legal.

Imagine if suddenly refined sugar became illegal in Mexico, suddenly the government would have to fight not only the obesity epidemic, but also the sugar trafficking criminals.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#84
post #5

Fentanyl is one of the few drugs I can buy all the anti-drug propaganda on given the insane death rate compared to other drugs (I remember meth being advertised on tv as deadly)[1]. But it's the direct result of making alternatives harder to get and harder to produce. [1] https://nida.nih.gov/research-topics/trends-statistics/overd...

A lot of street drugs are being laced with fentanyl, so like you think you are just snorting cocaine but someone in the chain snuck a bunch of fent so they could skimp on more expensive cocaine and still have a potent product.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#85
post #10

Non US person here, so feel free to call me out on BS. IMHO people who do fentanyl already have pretty serious mental and/or existential issues going on, like who tf would play russian roulette like that? Sounds more like a societal problem than a mere drug distribution regulation problem to me.

Sometimes (from what I've read, I'm also non-US) many people who end up on fentanyl were not even going through any mental or existential issues, at least not overtly, but rather were prescribed opiates such as oxycodone after being legitimately diagnosed with more-or-less severe and prolonged pain. When I say they were "legitimately" diagnosed, I mean that the patient didn't fake their ailment nor went to the doctor…

Fent is mostly a street drug. While i guess those cases exist, the problem we are seeing now is mainly a flood of cheap fent on the street from people who have probably never been prescribed opioids before (or indeed, haven’t seen a doctor very much at all in their life). The older middle class people who were/are abusing opioids aren’t the same people on the street who never had much anyways.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#86
post #82

I had to get a colonoscopy and be awake for the whole thing. They gave me fentanyl (my first and only time ever experiencing this drug) for the procedure. I have very fond memories of the entire experience, which is extremely disconcerting considering what was going on at the time. This drug probably shouldn’t exist imho.

Shit, I once got a colonoscopy in the UK's NHS without sedatives nor opioids. It freaking hurt a lot which apparently shouldn't have. That gave doctors the clue that I had IBS and a very sensitive colon apparently (I didn't have anything wrong from what they saw). All future colonoscopies I've had, I demand to get knocked out. Better for everyone haha

Getting knocked out is standard for colonoscopies in the states. I can’t imagine doing that awake. The worst part is the laxative the day before, I didn’t get anti-nausea meds, I will totally go for those next time.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to share a similar position until I realized: drugs are bad, actually, and there should be substantial friction in making them available to people. Disincentivizing drug consumption is a good thing. The war on drugs obviously leads to some absurdities - e.g. drug cartels, unnecessary incarceration - and I much prefer the Portuguese model. But making fentanyl in particular available in the grocery store would b…

What led to your realization that "drugs are bad", and does that include all external consciousness altering substances? (caffeine, alcohol, nicotine, THC, and so on).

It’s not binary.

Drugs that kill or otherwise destroy your life are very bad. Other drugs that don’t do that are probably much less bad, and we should allow things somewhere that fall under a line between not bad and very bad. Where that line exists is a matter of current debate.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are drug users going to know what they are buying if they are illegal to sell? Dealers are putting fentanyl in cocaine nowadays. It wouldn’t surprise me if a large number of fentanyl overdoses were by people who had no idea they were taking fentanyl at all.

Decriminalizing drug use is intended to solve a different problem - that being throwing people in jail for being addicts is bad in a number of ways and consequences. Making all drugs legal and available (with quality assurance) will (at least help) solve the problem you are talking about, but will at the same time create whole new problems that more and easier access to drugs will mean more people try and use them an…

Decriminalizing use basically decriminalizes selling as far as I can tell here in the northwest. Police and prosecutors can no longer threaten users with legal action to give up their dealers, and since buying is now low risk, dealing also becomes lower risk. I’ve seen people on the street looking for drugs and find them on my morning walks (they are pretty vocal when asking, and dealers aren’t shy about replying).

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minor nitpick: when you provide figures in the multiple thousands, it really improves readability if you use the thousand separator (40000 -> 40,000, and even more so 100000 -> 100,000). Thanks.

To be fair in many parts of the world 40000 and 100000 is written like this 40.000 and 100.000. So it may confuse non Americans.

Yes, I don't really use thousands separators because I use both number systems regularly and the ambiguity annoys me. It's not a practical issue in this case I think as almost everyone would assume US numbers here. But they feel weird to me somehow. I have used spaces at times as a thousands separator, but that might be even more confusing.

Re: How the fentanyl crisis' fourth wave has hit every corner of the US

#90
post #5

Fentanyl is one of the few drugs I can buy all the anti-drug propaganda on given the insane death rate compared to other drugs (I remember meth being advertised on tv as deadly)[1]. But it's the direct result of making alternatives harder to get and harder to produce. [1] https://nida.nih.gov/research-topics/trends-statistics/overd...

It is a direct result of the drug war... Legalize all drugs, disempower doctors from being gatekeepers and allow anyone to get anything they want at any time, aside from age restrictions and things like antibiotics (which can contribute to making bacteria more robust and dangerous). Testable, trackable access to all drugs, without any stigma of illegality. This removes all incentive for adulterated substances, gives…

I kind of agree, I agree 100% with transparency, it's something I think the UK does wonders with having drug testing sites where they don't confiscate the drug instead the user themselves can decide if they want to take whatever toxic waste is mixed in with MDMA for instance.

I don't think legalizing it to the point where anyone can get it anywhere is the way to go, you have to rehabilitate not only users but the drug itself.

Ecstasy as an example will contribute to death as long as people see ecstasy as a party drug (since most cause of death is because of heat stroke or drinking too much water), if you can rehabilitate the public perception that ecstasy is more of a relax drug akin to weed, then I think we're on to something.

Issue is also that the cartel has grown so vast and powerful I doubt even if USA went full legalization that this will change much, the cartel will find grey area to smuggle in "illegal" legal drugs like how the Italian mafia are notorious for fake olive oil.

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