Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

workerorganizing.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 380 posts

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#91

Post by ketchupdebugger »

aknfxb3m wrote: post #4

In my country we had mandated unions for tech workers in various states. I paid the compulsory annual fee plus an additional fee that I didn't understand and can't properly explain what it was for. Not once in 23 years in IT have they done anything for me. Not a single time. Every time we pushed for raises and someone contacted the union, nothing came back. When the company was not updating our salaries against infla…

Do you get to vote for union reps? If they aren't doing the job can't you just vote them out?

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#92

Post by jandrewrogers »

giantg2 wrote: post #21
infecto wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what country? Software engineers have some incredible pay for pretty low effort in the last 15years. Even before that it was a pretty decent living for most of the time pretty non-unique software. We are talking about them as an exploited working class, wild to me.

Given that they are typically salaried, I wonder what the hour adjusted pay is? The median for a dev in the US is $110k, and many of those jobs fall in higher than average cost of living areas. It's possible that people in the industry want better working conditions or more equal/open pay systems, not just more money. Better hiring practices could be nice too.

The median software developer job is not in a high-cost area. $110k is less than what the median software developer is paid in e.g. Omaha, Nebraska, where the median house price is $275k.

In the US, software developers are highly compensated by local standards almost regardless of where they live. That was not always the case decades ago but it is today.

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#94

Post by infinitezest »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #47
FrustratedMonky wrote: post #5

Tech workers are usually so buried, heads hunched over the keyboard, focused on the latest project, that they aren't even aware they are being used. They straiten their back one day, look around, and realize they've been working for 20 years and getting nowhere. They got good enough raises, but forgot inflation, and it was really nothing.

> realize they've been working for 20 years and getting nowhere How are you defining "getting nowhere"? At least in the US, the average software developer eventually becomes a millionaire working a pretty cushy job with good benefits. Most people in unions wish they could be exploited like software engineers. Any bar set so high in defining worker exploitation that a software engineer can't clear the hurdle is not a…

Do you have a source for the claim of the average software engineer becomes a millionaire? As a software engineer I would really like for you to be correct.

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#95

Post by micromacrofoot »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #17
badcppdev wrote: post #6

I guess the trouble is that we don't have any self-admitted exploited workers. Everyone is a temporarily embarrassed Founder/CTO. With thanks to Steinback - https://hellyesjohnsteinbeck.tumblr.com/post/23486952183/com...

At least in the US, the average software developer does eventually become a millionaire, working a pretty cushy job. If that is "exploitation" then most people would be like to be exploited like that.

I don't think this is average, common maybe.

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#96

Post by runako »

pydry wrote: post #65
itsoktocry wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The best engineers are worth literally 10x the worst engineers Uh, I'm pretty sure the best employees in any field are worth 10x what the worst employees are, whether you're writing code, assembling a car or gutting fish. The economics of labour suggest unions are most valuable where there's a monopsony buyer of labour. Big Tech might fit that bill, especially when we know they colluded to depress salaries.

This idea crops up so frequently that Ive started calling it the "Apparently Tom Cruise Works in a Factory" fallacy.

Is Tom Cruise represented by a union?

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#97

Post by hospitalJail »

The Physicians have a cartel, Pharmacists have a cartel, why can't we create our own cartel?

The only way this would work, is if we entrench ourselves into US politics and spend hundreds of millions of dollars of bribery/lobbying money.

Sure its definitely going to be bad for the rest of US citizens, but if the medical field is going to extort us, why can't we join in?

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#99

Post by cmiles74 »

kdmccormick wrote: post #19
infecto wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what country? Software engineers have some incredible pay for pretty low effort in the last 15years. Even before that it was a pretty decent living for most of the time pretty non-unique software. We are talking about them as an exploited working class, wild to me.

IMHO our profession's adherence to ethics and technical standards is shockingly low compared to others. If a civil engineer was asked to build a bridge that will probably be unsafe, I think they and their colleagues would have the power to refuse (right?). If a software engineer is asked to ship a feature that's probably insecure then... IDK, gotta get it to prod, move fast and break things, right? I wonder if unioni…

Healthcare is pretty reliant on software, that's an area that strikes me as being susceptible to something like this. Banks and their associated (i.e. Equifax) are also in a position where this kind of feedback from developers could make a difference.

Re: Tech Workers Deserve a Union: An Interview with Ethan Marcotte

#100

Post by [deleted] »

mmmmmbop wrote: post #36
pc86 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average software developer makes $110k/yr, and there's a clear differentiation between having a million dollars (or million s ) in your 20s and 30s compared to retiring with $2-3 million in a 401k that you need to live off of for four decades.

$2-3 million in a 401k by retirement age is still 30-40x the median amount. [0] [0] https://www.bankrate.com/retirement/average-401k-balance-by-...

[deleted]
Post reply on HN