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Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

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Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#291

Post by steve1977 »

irrational wrote: post #179
RoyTyrell wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My girlfriend's sister suffers from Long Covid for going on 2yrs now. Some of the problems she had early on is that most doctors wrote her off as either lying or anxiety. More than one ER doc said there's no way that Covid could ever cause lasting symptoms other than lung damage, which she didn't have, so it's likely just anxiety. There was one DO she saw, during an admit for tachycardia, who said that he believed th…

> but trying to get his colleagues to believe it would be an uphill battle You have to go through a lot of education to become a doctor, so people naturally expect doctor's to be wise, but the truth is they are just good a memorizing things. They aren't necessarily smarter than any other person and have just as many blindspots. * Source: My dad and uncle are doctors. My brother in law is a doctor. I have a friend who…

I see doctors a bit like car mechanics. While car engineers would probably more be something like biologists.

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#292

Post by Llamamoe »

lindsaywaterman wrote: post #219
Llamamoe wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're looking at is people with really bad gut microbiomes or other ongoing infections, not "CSS" - the behavior you're describing is called sickness behavior[1] and is produced by ongoing infections and blood infiltration by bacterial toxins like LPS (which coincidentally is used to induce mouse models of depression) Rhetoric like yours is why most chronically ill people suffer for years and decades before get…

Well - I myself had cfs and found that pacing and mindfulness really helped! I think these approaches have been empowering for both myself and hundreds of my patients. And there is some clinical research there to back my opinions up. however I am always open to and hopeful that other approaches like those that go via the microbiome, will be helpful.

I believe you, but at the same time you have to take the correction for the fact that humans are storytelling creatures- we correlate our life experiences with our internal experience and spin them into stories by instinct- I've never met anyone who wasn't convinced their illness was related to life events and mindset for a long while before stumbling onto a diagnosis.

So I always wonder, are we seeing successful treatment of somatic complaints, or are we seeing regression to the mean spun into a story, or perhaps both?

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#294

Post by qwytw »

talldatethrow wrote: post #270
ricardobeat wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think taking the fiber out of vegetables is good?

Because without doing so I can't eat 1000-1500 calories of vegetables. I think this is worth doing once every few years at least for 90 days.

By juice do you mean do you mean you just blend those vegetables more or less whole or actual (pressed/etc.) juice?

Because if second that sounds like a terrible idea. If first you might have a good point as long you make sure to get the necessary nutrients etc.

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#295

Post by 221qqwe »

talldatethrow wrote: post #201
irrational wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but trying to get his colleagues to believe it would be an uphill battle You have to go through a lot of education to become a doctor, so people naturally expect doctor's to be wise, but the truth is they are just good a memorizing things. They aren't necessarily smarter than any other person and have just as many blindspots. * Source: My dad and uncle are doctors. My brother in law is a doctor. I have a friend who…

I dated a med school student for all of medschool and some rotations. Thus I have countless doctor friends now from those years. Everytime I bring up the reality of what most doctors are like, I get downvoted on HN for some reason. The doctor I dated for years never drank water. She loved diet coke. She ate mcdonalds constantly but avoided the bun. She was skinny though. I had to teach her how to pump gas because her…

> She ate mcdonalds constantly but avoided the bun

If she also skipped the fries (and had salad instead) that wouldn't be the worst imaginable diet.

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#296

Post by GordonS »

smearth wrote: post #237
smearth wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the best way to think about the syndrome is that you are a really terrible athlete. I find it a healthy way to reframe what I’m dealing with. I laughed at Eric the Eel, he’s laghing at me taking out the rubbish now. They say athleticism is a reduction in recovery period. Combine this with the fact the brain burns loads of energy and certain aspects of the brain uses things like the inner ear and vagal nerves…

Sorry I misread kettle for kettle bell. But the load is irrelevant. If you are that weak then start with fragmented swimmers stretches 1 limb at a time. I was in the same situation in 2018 but you do forget once you escape. Just do 1 rep on each limb every second day until you can do two. Or figure out the training periodicity for your body so that you can build up to 30 swimmers stretches. Then add in another exerci…

I'm not "strong" by any means, but I wouldn't say I was weak either; the problem is that I'm not lacking the strength to lift the kettle (or my own arms, for that matter), rather that lactic acid doesn't allow me to use the strength I have for any length of time.

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#297

Post by freilanzer »

hirako2000 wrote: post #131
thenerdhead wrote: post #115

Isn't it pretty well-known that many diseases/disorders are likely from post-viral infection? Howard Bloom who famously had CFS for decades talked about how he had a bad flu that never got better and his long recovery from it. https://medicalerrorinterviews.podbean.com/e/howard-bloom-pa... Michael J Fox who famously has Parkinson's mentioned being sick in his documentary "Still" while filming "Leo and Me" where other…

Why is it such an issue that people deny it? Viruses can cause organ tissue damages, that's enough for me to believe a virus can cause all sort of "syndromes" I'm not on the denier side but harass me with fear, threats, and free movement mandates and I will deny that syndromes even exist.

Because I've been running from doctor to doctor for years without results - because they won't test for anything other than the regular stuff, like blood tests, heart issues, etc. My boss doesn't believe me since CFS or burnout couldn't possibly exist, you just need to focus on your work more. Everytime I say I can't go out since I'm too tired I get made fun of or have eyes rolled at me.

It's like denying someone has a broken arm and gets ridiculed for not wanting to play tennis.

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#298

Post by Fluorescence »

thenerdhead wrote: post #115

Isn't it pretty well-known that many diseases/disorders are likely from post-viral infection? Howard Bloom who famously had CFS for decades talked about how he had a bad flu that never got better and his long recovery from it. https://medicalerrorinterviews.podbean.com/e/howard-bloom-pa... Michael J Fox who famously has Parkinson's mentioned being sick in his documentary "Still" while filming "Leo and Me" where other…

> mentioned being sick in his documentary "Still"

I just saw this and he doesn't say that. He says that he was drinking with Woody Harrelson, had to be helped into his suite by a bodyguard and "I woke with a monster hangover" when he first noticed the auto-animated finger.

> where other crew members also have Parkinsons

Michael J. Fox himself throws some cold water over this to avoid over-extrapolating:

"Believe it or not, from a scientific point of view, that's not significant."[4] Donald Calne, a Vancouver neurologist, said the incidence of Parkinson's in society is about 1 in 300, but that four of the 125 people on the Vancouver set of Leo and Me developed the disease. Calne said, "It could be coincidence. But it's intriguing, it might be something they were exposed to."

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#299

Post by thenerdhead »

Fluorescence wrote: post #298
thenerdhead wrote: post #115

Isn't it pretty well-known that many diseases/disorders are likely from post-viral infection? Howard Bloom who famously had CFS for decades talked about how he had a bad flu that never got better and his long recovery from it. https://medicalerrorinterviews.podbean.com/e/howard-bloom-pa... Michael J Fox who famously has Parkinson's mentioned being sick in his documentary "Still" while filming "Leo and Me" where other…

> mentioned being sick in his documentary "Still" I just saw this and he doesn't say that. He says that he was drinking with Woody Harrelson, had to be helped into his suite by a bodyguard and "I woke with a monster hangover" when he first noticed the auto-animated finger. > where other crew members also have Parkinsons Michael J. Fox himself throws some cold water over this to avoid over-extrapolating: "Believe it o…

It is briefly mentioned when he is talking about his “workaholism” when he was young and also part of many articles on this phenomena. See the wiki page for sources.

> So what about Fox and the suspected Leo and Me cluster? Did they all breathe in some environmental toxin in the studio? Or did they perhaps pass the disease to each other? One theory, that has been around for years, is that Parkinson's could be caused - or perhaps triggered - by a viral infection, maybe even influenza.

> Dr Donald Calne, of the University of British Columbia Hospital, is treating two of the cast of Leo and Me. He told the Chicago Sun-Times that studies have found there to be an increased risk of clusters among certain workers who operate closely together - principally teachers, medical workers, loggers and miners. They could, the theory goes, be exposed to more viruses than most people, and this might cause them to develop the disease.

Re: Chronic fatigue syndrome may have a post-viral infection origin

#300

Post by Fluorescence »

thenerdhead wrote: post #299
Fluorescence wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> mentioned being sick in his documentary "Still" I just saw this and he doesn't say that. He says that he was drinking with Woody Harrelson, had to be helped into his suite by a bodyguard and "I woke with a monster hangover" when he first noticed the auto-animated finger. > where other crew members also have Parkinsons Michael J. Fox himself throws some cold water over this to avoid over-extrapolating: "Believe it o…

It is briefly mentioned when he is talking about his “workaholism” when he was young and also part of many articles on this phenomena. See the wiki page for sources. > So what about Fox and the suspected Leo and Me cluster? Did they all breathe in some environmental toxin in the studio? Or did they perhaps pass the disease to each other? One theory, that has been around for years, is that Parkinson's could be caused…

> It is briefly mentioned when he is talking about his “workaholism”

You'll have to timestamp or quote it because I don't see it. I have searched the subtitles. No relevant mention of sick, ill, flu, work etc.

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