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Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

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Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#371

Post by 9991 »

rapind wrote: post #351
wiz21c wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. With Linux I don't get bullied to install their stuff. But you'll say "but you get bugs, less mature desktop environment" (just one point of my daily usage). Yeah sure, but instead of complaining about being bullied I get a chance to help the folks who make the programs I use (bug reports, small commits). So instead of a negative feeling, I have a positive feeling. That's an enormous difference to me. Let's have…

> With Linux I don't get bullied to install their stuff. $ sudo apt full-upgrade ... Get more security updates through Ubuntu Pro with 'esm-apps' enabled ... Learn more about Ubuntu Pro at https://xxxxxxxxxxxxx/pro

Yea, there are distros with ads and tracking, and that's a stain on them, and on the people who willingly put up with it. Debian and Pop!_OS are great, btw.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#372

Post by alpaca128 »

marcodiego wrote: post #342
wiz21c wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. With Linux I don't get bullied to install their stuff. But you'll say "but you get bugs, less mature desktop environment" (just one point of my daily usage). Yeah sure, but instead of complaining about being bullied I get a chance to help the folks who make the programs I use (bug reports, small commits). So instead of a negative feeling, I have a positive feeling. That's an enormous difference to me. Let's have…

> "but you get bugs, less mature desktop environment" I don't think a linux distro maintained since 2020 feels less mature of more buggy than proprietary alternatives.

Agreed. I'm currently on Mac OS and almost daily I get UI glitches/bugs in the dock and notifications, which puzzles me a bit. I mean I understand that they don't care about whatever crashes the terminal when it runs with 10 windows for weeks at a time, but the dock is visible for all users and I don't think I'm doing anything special to it.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#373

Post by vladvasiliu »

cbozeman wrote: post #355
sandworm101 wrote: post #304

Every day of bad new for Microsoft and Windows is another great day for Linux. You all have a choice. Make it.

Oh yeah... I love the Linux version of Accounting CS. It's great. You know what else is great? The Linux version of CCH ProSystem fx is also rock solid. Ohhh wait. Those things don't exist. Just like a bunch of EHR software that I have to support doesn't exist either. They all run on Windows. Most of this stuff doesn't even run on Mac OS X. The business world runs on Windows. Period. That'll change when Linux develop…

I'm not familiar with any of the software you've mentioned. But in my neck of the woods, more and more software is moving to web-based SaaS form. There's no reason to insist on using the PITA that's Windows when a Chromebook or similar would do as good a job, or very likely even better.

Sure, for "heavier" local software, you may not have a choice. But in the company I work for, nobody uses such software any longer, yet they still cling to Windows. "Because we've always used this".

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#374

Post by wildrhythms »

mlazos wrote: post #305

This stems from modern companies’ obsession with measurable impact. If it can’t be measured it might as well not exist. Unfortunately UX has to become very very bad before the effect is measurable (losing users) and by then it is much too late, especially when the company has near monopoly power. I hope they figure out that they need to make feedback easier to gather so that they can get back to making good products.

I have seen firsthand these companies only promote based on 'new' UI. The higherups want to see new shiny features that they can take credit for; not an improvement on an existing design that their predecessor came up with.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#375

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

rjbwork wrote: post #258
hnlmorg wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember when we first found out that IE could be uninstalled from Windows 98 and thus what eventually lead the EU to mandate Microsoft give Windows users a choice of 3rd party browsers. Back then businesses were a lot more scared of the repercussions of anti-competitive behaviour than they are now.

>Back then businesses were a lot more scared of the repercussions of anti-competitive behaviour than they are now. Reasonably, too. Governments seem reluctant to actually regulate anti-competitive behavior these days, especially from tech giants. I think it must be a kind of technological "too big to fail".

> Governments seem reluctant to actually regulate anti-competitive behavior these days, especially from tech giants.

True. US states are ramping up production of tech laws but those laws typically fall into two categories. Laws that only large tech houses can afford and/or unconstitutional reactionary laws.

At best these laws do no good for the consumer. They absolutely do nothing do encourage competition.

Most of them, however, bring tons of harm like gifting abusable power to govs and helping big tech further entrench their dominance.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#376

Post by snarfy »

smcl wrote: post #313

Has to be pretty embarrassing for the Edge developers that something they've worked on is mostly known as a punchline or an annoyance shoved down people's throats, rather than a product that can stand and compete on its own two feet.

Chrome has its own bullshit. When Edge decided to switch to being based on Chromium I had high hopes Microsoft could build a better Chrome than Google could.

Man, what a letdown.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#377

Post by green_biri »

cutler wrote: post #363
oefrha wrote: post #301

Last time I tested an extension of mine on Edge, I counted four or five distinct ways Windows and Edge tried to convince or coax me into setting Edge as default. (Coaxing includes but isn’t limited to full-screen one-click “finish setting up your computer” on boot which includes adopting “Microsoft-recommended” browser security settings which of course means resetting the default browser. It appeared on every reboot…

It always surprised me how even savvy devs bought WSL as proof of Microsoft's good intentions. If you lived through Microsoft's antics in the 90s and 00s you could never imagine them changing. Well, here's the proof - they haven't. WSL was introduced purely to grab a piece of the expanding Linux market and followed their attempts to extort money from Red Hat and Suse via their bogus Linux patents racket.

WSL allows me to use Linux from Windows in the most acessible way since VMs.

What drives you to claim that it is simply an extortion attempt?

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#379

Post by thfuran »

wiz21c wrote: post #349
thfuran wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I get a chance to help the folks who make the programs I use (bug reports, small commits Approximately 0.0% of users see that as an opportunity.

Approximately 0.0% of the users actually produce those programs. And yet, we got those programs...

Yes, the fact that there are far more users than developers is my point. "All users have a choice! They just need to learn to write and debug software to address the bugs they'll encounter in the alternatives" is a bit of an unreasonable position.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#380

Post by jmartrican »

jacquesm wrote: post #378

Edge is trash. If Microsoft wants to do something positive for the browser diversity landscape they should match Google $ for $ on support for Mozilla, with the stipulation that the funds can only be used for FireFox.

Why do you say it is trash? I use it regularly. I use it primarily to test and code (e.g. inspect and tweak styles) a few web apps I code. I really like some of its features.

What I didn't like was how it kept asking me to make it the default browser every time it upgraded.

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