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Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

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Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#321

Post by zelphirkalt »

sam345 wrote: post #106
bachmeier wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Linux required almost-daily googling and opening up a terminal to fix or change something. I usually try to avoid discussions of the OS, since it's such a terribly boring topic. However, this is quite an extraordinary claim that is made without any details. Perhaps you could elaborate. As someone that has used various Linux distros for nearly twenty years, I don't think I could construct a scenario in which someone…

I believe it. I've used linux desktops for 20 years also and command line is definitely a must on a daily basis. Ive also used Windows and agree that it just fades into background. Windows 10/11 definitely less paiinful on the desktop. These days with better integration with and tools for Linux cli, Windows is definitely my preferred gui productivity environment. Many Linux fans don't know better or won't admit it be…

> Windows is definitely my preferred gui productivity environment

lmao, not because I don't believe you really think what you write, but because how user hostile everything in Windows seems to me, if you only want to change a single setting. It will be hidden behind 3 level deep settings dialogs and a "material design" flat links connecting those setting dialogs, so almost no visual indication, to make things stand out. It is horrible UI design. Basically any modern GNU/Linux DE will offer more feedback and visibility in their settings dialogs and windows.

Whenever I have to change any settings on Windows, I get a feeling of dread, because I know I will be searching for that setting. And never is the search any help, because they will name things different than I expect or it simply will not find the settings dialog I need to change that setting.

It is almost like they intentionally hide the settings ... Windows feels like a system that protects clueless users from themselves.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#322

Post by wiz21c »

sandworm101 wrote: post #304

Every day of bad new for Microsoft and Windows is another great day for Linux. You all have a choice. Make it.

Yup. With Linux I don't get bullied to install their stuff. But you'll say "but you get bugs, less mature desktop environment" (just one point of my daily usage). Yeah sure, but instead of complaining about being bullied I get a chance to help the folks who make the programs I use (bug reports, small commits). So instead of a negative feeling, I have a positive feeling.

That's an enormous difference to me.

Let's have this cheap Linux phone and my life will be great.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#323

Post by alexvitkov »

Microsoft probably has better data than me, but I can't imagine that that many people switch to Edge after Microsoft forcefully opens it when you try to search for a local file.

Just show some fucking respect to your users, it will be worth more than the 0.003% market share you get from opening Edge when I click a pdf

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#324

Post by offices »

fhd2 wrote: post #288
ryzvonusef wrote: post #255

I use Edge on my laptop (because of Bing Chat, easy to use on Edge, without faffing around on OpenAI), and Microsoft still won't stop trying to push it on me every once in a while. (on windows 10, because of TPM1.2, small blessings) Like chill, you already got me. I am not going to remove Chrome and Firefox, but you are the default browser already and I use Bing too, now go away.

A: "Edge conversations are up 4%! What else can we do to increase them?" B: "Users that already have Edge as their default browser also see these, shouldn't we first fix that?" A: "That wouldn't increase Edge conversions, would it?" B: "No, but..." A: "Then we don't have time for that. What can we do to increase them?" Been there - not at Microsoft, but it's not particularly unique to them.

Maybe B doesn't exist because B uses Chrome.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#325

Post by Karsteski »

janfoeh wrote: post #300
shmde wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can I ask you for a recommendation on where to get a license? You have to sail the high seas. Unless you are a business you cannot possibly get an LTSC license. Such a bummer that the quintessential Windows 10 experience cannot be bought by the average public.

Thanks! How unfortunate. Maybe I'll have to give Linux + Proton a shot, although I don't relish the additional complication regarding hardware selection...

Yea you gotta just go AMD gpu. I had an NVIDIA RTX 3070 and despite being decently technically proficient I could never deal with the hassle of Linux gaming. I bought an AMD 6950 XT and immediately many random issues I was having like league of legends crashing or bugging out just stopped. Granted I also switched from default fedora to fedora with the Sway WM so there are some confounding variables there. Even a brand new game like Starfield just worked™ for me, which was quite surprising. I do just leave Steam on Proton experimental so that may have something to do with it.

Anyways, I'd recommend Linux gaming now to anyone if they have AMD hardware and value privacy. There are definitely still some quirks and typical Linux configuring but even for someone as impatient and intolerant to that stuff as me, it's been pretty good so far

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#326

Post by ImaCake »

brucethemoose2 wrote: post #145

I used to be ambivalent about Edge. It actually has some nice integrated features I would normally need (slow) addons for, and better integration in Windows features (like better DRM for video streaming). I even used it in linux some. ...But I just recently tested it on a brand new Windows desktop, and I can't believe how slow and spammy it feels out-of-the-box compared to Thorium/Chromite now.

Yeah the actual product is great. But the KPIs at microsoft have lead to some extremely distasteful dark patterns ruining the experience.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#327

Post by kevincox »

theusus wrote: post #266
no_wizard wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Edge is effectively chrome under the hood. It’s not doing much for browser diversity

Chrome does its own stuff. Lately, they added a tracking different from cookies, something that Brave has said they won't be adding. I want the market to segregate at every level.

Brave and a few other derivatives will block these high profile features. But they don't have the resources to maintain many of these exceptions. For example look at Brave's response to manifest v2. They say that they will try to support it for longer but they are careful to promise little. Because they know they don't have the resources to maintain all of the underlying APIs and their own extension store.

Plus this helps entrench Chromium as the only browser engine. Because even the addition of many non-harmful features that other engines don't implement create compatibility issues that results in developers using these new features so sites break. Firefox gets unsupported so people have to switch to Chrome or a derivative.

So yes, a derivative is better than using Google Chrome. But it is a small improvement compared to switching to a different browser engine.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#328

Post by zo1 »

doyouevensunbro wrote: post #146
antiframe wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens when you press Win, type a query, then press enter, quickly? In Win 10 that opens a Bing search in Edge for me, no matter what settings I try. Very annoying when I type "(Win)chr(enter)" to open Chrome and get a search instead. If I do it slow it will sometimes work. I haven't tried it on Win 11 because that was what caused me to drop Windows altogether. (Everyone has their straw).

I launch apps from the Win key all the time, never ending up in Edge. The worst for me is ending up in “Internet Options” when I want to launch IntelliJ.

Try typing something that ends up doing a "search" is what they're suggesting.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#329

Post by offices »

smcl wrote: post #313

Has to be pretty embarrassing for the Edge developers that something they've worked on is mostly known as a punchline or an annoyance shoved down people's throats, rather than a product that can stand and compete on its own two feet.

And the strategy of your employers implies that your work to improve the product doesn't actually matter, only tricking customers into becoming users does.

There can be no discussion about the relative quality of Edge without this subject in the foreground. The only word-of-mouth is from the tricked users who don't know the difference and just see it as the button for the internet. It doesn't matter if you introduce a regression that makes it slower, they'll just blame it on the 'wifi'.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#330

Post by layer8 »

smcl wrote: post #313

Has to be pretty embarrassing for the Edge developers that something they've worked on is mostly known as a punchline or an annoyance shoved down people's throats, rather than a product that can stand and compete on its own two feet.

It was already embarrassing that they had to give up on their own engine and had to adopt Chromium.
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