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Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

gizmodo.com

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Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#571

Post by callalex »

sedro wrote: post #453
Scoring6931 wrote: post #428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Already a thing in the UK, where the cheapest insurance options require the installation of a telemetry black box in the car.

It's the same in parts of the US. In California, insurers are only allowed to collect the mileage.

>In California, insurers are only allowed to collect the mileage.

Hmm, I am in California and have stalker auto insurance. The app they provide me shows a complete GPS map of every trip I take. So they definitely collect that information, but maybe you’re saying they can’t price discriminate based on it? Where did you learn about that rule?

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#572

Post by Night_Thastus »

tredre3 wrote: post #562
Night_Thastus wrote: post #531

I honestly don't get the hate for modern cars that some people have. I recently got a 2023 Corolla, and it's fantastic: * Android Auto gives me a great GPS to navigate anywhere, anytime. It watches out for traffic, accidents, speed traps, etc. and keeps me informed and on the fastest route * I can have my phone's whole music library to listen to instead of fiddling with another copy on a USB stick that I'd have to ke…

I'm not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse or not, but this is an article about how cars collect telemetry. This is what everybody is talking about in the comments. I'm sure everybody here enjoys most modern car features you've listed. They just don't like being spied on.

I know what the article about, but the comments of the post are full of unrelated new-car-hate, at least that's what I saw.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#573

Post by neuralRiot »

sergiosgc wrote: post #262
tristor wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate them so much. Otherwise great cars are completely ruined by touchscreens. What was wrong with tactile knobs you could operate one handed without looking? You’re driving for fuck’s sake. It’s why things like the GR Corolla are nearly miraculous in 2023, it even comes stick shift only.

As an European, where we drive mostly stick, it's funny to observe the newfound US love for stick shifts. It's funny because it happened almost exactly when automatics became good! Good dual clutch gearboxes are amazing, but even "classic" ones like BMW's ZF6 or ZF8 are really close. ZF8 is so good BMW uses it in the M3, instead of a dual clutch. With these options, I'd never go back to stick shift. This after having…

DSG are wonderful but an added complexity for the sake of what? Shaving 0.5sec 0-60mph? Saving the hassle of slow traffic driving? Both can be fixed by learning to drive.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#574

Post by neuralRiot »

ravenstine wrote: post #502
cpursley wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Manuals suck in traffic. Americans sit in a lot of traffic. And I say this as somebody who loves manuals (I’m an amateur race car driver).

Yeah, I certainly wouldn't knock those who love driving manual. Part of why I like riding my motorcycle is that it's a manual. But in LA traffic, I'd rather drive an automatic so I can put my brain into "autopilot" while playing an audiobook rather than have to constantly be shifting by hand. It irks me how so many manual-lovers have this superiority complex over people who just want a car that will get them from A t…

I’ve driven manual my whole car life and in heavy US traffic. When you get accustomed, your brain goes into “auto-pilot” and does the shifting too anyway.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#575

Post by AngryData »

ilikehurdles wrote: post #205
HumblyTossed wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I assume it's a cost thing. Is it though? It's not like they have to reinvent the button each time. Buttons that last a decade or three have already been designed.

Auto margins are ridiculously thin, and if a manufacturer can trim 17 cents off a car’s manufacturing cost by removing a button, they usually will.

Their margins being thin is a matter of perspective. Most farms are running 1% profit margins on average and have massive variations in yield that auto production lacks.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#576

Post by thfuran »

hedora wrote: post #362
tristor wrote: post #132

Of all the horrible things go on with privacy these days, this is the one I hate the most. I’m a “car guy”, but not the sort that obsesses over old cars (although I do love 60s and 80s cars). I like new tech, I like the advances in engineering we’ve made in new vehicles, I like EVs even. Nonetheless I’ve been in the market for a new car for months and haven’t bought because it’s hard to find any cars that meet my req…

I was planning to get a Nissan Leaf (worst privacy among all manufacturers in the round up) but luckily stumbled on a BMW i3 instead. They have the best telemetry story by far, and it has a well-implemented jog wheel instead of a touch screen. Also, it has a carbon-fiber frame. It looks like a tall econobox, but handles extremely well. The i3 has been discontinued and the new models have a touch screen in addition to…

Didn't bmw turn seat heaters into a subscription service? I'm not sure avoiding treating customers terribly is really their thing.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#577

Post by ilikehurdles »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #554
wyre wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your post under says margins of 6%? 17 cents over a 6% margin on a $30,000+ purchase would be like McDonalds charging for extra salt on their fries. I’d guess it’s an ease of design and manufacturing decision when you can eliminate so many buttons so easily.

> would be like McDonalds charging for extra salt on their fries. Aren't they? I had a vague impression it happened. And of course, some McDonalds' locations charge you something absurd for an extra ketchup packet.

Pretty much any McDonalds I’ve been to in Central Europe has a charge on each condiment pack.

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#578

Post by thfuran »

Night_Thastus wrote: post #555
EricE wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

just wait until insurance companies demand access to your telemetry or they triple your rates.

I had to go this route already. As a new driver, my rates were quite high - and the best option for lowering that was letting them track my driving through an app on my phone. I don't particularly like it, but it's something I'll just have to live with.

What if you buy a second phone that you always leave at home?

Re: Internet-connected cars fail privacy and security tests conducted by Mozilla

#580

Post by bdavbdav »

Tangurena2 wrote: post #127
giantg2 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another reason to do my own service or find a trusted independent shop.

The car companies won't let that information out to independent repair shops (except where mandated by laws). The "right to repair" movement is one attempt to make it possible. The worst offender is John Deere and their newer farm tractors. Only authorized repair centers can get the software needed to troubleshoot the vehicles. Part of why Deere does not want details out there is that some tractor models have the exa…

IMHO, the decent indies are all sat on copies of either the original dealer software (by whatever means…) or copies built by companies to emulate original dealer software (VCDS for VAG for example)
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