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No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

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Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#241

The first few paragraphs are confusing. Are the attendees unable to drive out through the mud, or are they forbidden to try by local authorities? Or some of both, forbidden to try because they might get stuck even worse?

They can if they'd like to, but they're unable. The kind of mud they're dealing with is very slippery, so, unless you bring a vehicle specifically designed for it, you're not going to be able to drive on it without being sunk up to your axles.

Would scoop tires work?

(If you brought them along on a spare set of rims and swapped them when it became clear what weather was coming)

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#242
post #137

At BRC now. It sucks. Everything is flooded. The man is not going to burn. There are 2 more days of rain forecasted. My guess is Wednesday when driving will be possible.

> The man is not going to burn I promise you, the man will burn if the burners are at all dedicated to the cause. Dried wood only soaks a few millimeters of rain unless it's completely submerged for a very long time. Use an accelerant to get it started, and nature will do the rest.

Man will burn tomorrow

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can if they'd like to, but they're unable. The kind of mud they're dealing with is very slippery, so, unless you bring a vehicle specifically designed for it, you're not going to be able to drive on it without being sunk up to your axles.

Would scoop tires work? (If you brought them along on a spare set of rims and swapped them when it became clear what weather was coming)

Mud tires would help, but only if you have 4WD really. With mud, you need floatation as much as you need traction, so, mud tires tend to be much wider with deeper tread.

Usually paddle tires (the ones with scoops) are used in sand, not mud.

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#244

The first few paragraphs are confusing. Are the attendees unable to drive out through the mud, or are they forbidden to try by local authorities? Or some of both, forbidden to try because they might get stuck even worse?

I would imagine that the authorities won't let you try to drive out if your vehicle doesn't look like it can handle traveling miles through deep mud. If nothing else, then because they'd then be obligated to rescue you when you inevitably get stuck.

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#245
post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is noise, and is being downvoted as such. There is no point in trying to read too much into it.

You would expect the original comment to be downvoted as well if that were the case.

> You would expect (..)

I would not, and a puerile "but hey started it" doesn't help your case. Noise is noise.

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#246

The people I've talked to there are mostly worried about missed flights and missed days of work and are otherwise totally fine. Next time we chat I'll ask about the bathroom situation! Though I suppose if push comes to shove you can always dig holes for a couple days.

> Though I suppose if push comes to shove you can always dig holes for a couple days.

Don't shit in standing water. Don't walk in water you just shit in. Currently everyone is surrounded by water. Shitting in a hole is just shitting in the water you're walking in.

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#247
post #232
post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. As noted in the paper, they are rare except for in severe trauma without prompt attention. Otherwise us humans would have a MUCH lower survival rate than we already do out in the wild. Or as the paper notes “The etiology may be traumatic or, rarely, nontraumatic.” Non-compound fractures can still cause serious issues if complicated somehow, or even long term loss of function of course if they aren’t set correct…

>> without prompt attention nope. there is no prompt attention in the current situation as noted in the paper incidence of fat embolism approaches 30% many undiagnosed incidence are discovered post mortem. you are attempting to minimize a dangerous situation. =========== >> EPIDEMIOLOGY The incidence of FES ranges from Bulger et al.,[3] in their retrospective study, reported an incidence of 2. Georgopoulos D, Bouros…

Your own refs point out it is usually not a problem, and there are very low occurancy rates. The situations it’s a problem, it’s obvious that there was a severe break.

The folks seeing higher rates are seeing them because their samples are coming from data sets with specific trauma backgrounds. Which is not surprising. If you look at postmortem results for people who died with broken bones, those folks all had severe issues! They died.

Probably none of them caused by getting their arm slammed in a car door, for example. Most likely caused by long falls off ladders, or car accidents, or industrial accidents, or getting beaten to death, or shot, or any number of traumatic events.

If you look at a dataset of all broken bones (which will be difficult to do frankly, as 90% of them won’t even show up in a database as they’ll be handled in an outpatient setting), the numbers will look wildly different.

In this situation if it was serious they’d just get medivac’d then. Which is not going to be difficult in this situation. If someone gets hit/run over with a vehicle, or hit by machinery, or has a giant pile of lumber collapse on them, or whatever, it’s not like anyone is going to tell them ‘oops, nothing we can do!’.

It’s mud. It makes walking and driving difficult. It isn’t going to make it hard for a helicopter with a decent pilot, especially with a helpful ground team. Reno has a very good medical center (several, actually).

Re: No way in or out of Burning Man after storm

#248
post #226

>Death at Burning Man investigated in US, thousands stranded by flooding https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/9/3/death-under-investig... >Trapped in Mud, Burning Man Attendees Are Told to Conserve Food https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/02/us/burning-man-storm-floo...

Willing to bet any amount of money that the death is drug related. There are a handful every year.

I'll take that bet. I'm guessing something electricity-related during a flood, or CO poisoning from a grill or heater inside a tent or trailer.

Also, one death per year is typical.

--------

2010: A man died in his tent from carbon monoxide poisoning due to a propane heater.

2011: A woman died from injuries sustained in a tent fire.

2012: A man was found dead in his tent; the cause was not publicly disclosed.

2014: A woman was struck and killed by a bus carrying festival participants.

2015: A man died from a fall at his campsite.

2017: A man ran into a fire and died from burn injuries.

2018: A man was found unresponsive in his vehicle and later pronounced dead; the cause was not publicly disclosed.

2019: A death was reported, but the cause was not publicly disclosed.

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