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Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

studyfinds.org

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Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would it not be more accurate to say, “they must be avoided in vitamin supplement form ”?

In general, supplements should not be taken without good reason, because their availability in concentrated form makes it very easy to consume too much, like is also the case for refined sugar. Consuming too much of anything that is useful in small quantities, is either useless or harmful. When restricted to the same small quantities that are normally available from natural sources, there are no significant differenc…

I was just trying to say that healthy diets are still healthy, and that this study does not implicate healthy foods in the same way that it implicates supplements, which I agree, are generally either unnecessary or unhealthy, with a few special cases.

I was also just making this point of clarification for other people, and not implying that a reasonable reading of your post would determine you thought otherwise.

Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#42
post #5

Does this mean that people undergoing chemo shouldn't have any supplements at all? Lutein, for example, is a strong antioxidant but also has anti-cancer properties. Edit: thanks for the replies!

I don't think this is the case for antioxidants across the board. Peter Langjoen, who has pioneered CoQ10 research and used it extensively clinically addressed coQ10 use with chemotherapy in this interview and reluctancy of cancer centers to allow patients to use it: https://youtu.be/9Z7X9WPWv4Y?si=avOV0u4ruy_zNslr&t=746.

While coenzyme Q10 may show indirect anticancer activity through its effect(s) on the immune system, there is evidence to suggest that analogs of this compound can suppress cancer growth directly[1].

1. https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/treatment/cam/hp/coenzym...

Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#44
post #32

I think that these results fit very well with the theory that cancer cells obtain energy from the fermentation pathway (as opposed to the oxidative pathway)

How so?

It just says "We’ve found that antioxidants activate a mechanism that causes cancer tumors to form new blood vessels" which doesn't suggest anything about different metabolic pathways

Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#47
post #5

Does this mean that people undergoing chemo shouldn't have any supplements at all? Lutein, for example, is a strong antioxidant but also has anti-cancer properties. Edit: thanks for the replies!

In literally 3 hours, I'm about to start my first iv chemo session (18 weeks total).

And yes I was instructed to not take any supplements, especially naturopathic stuff but even including common multivitamins.

Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#48

Other clickbait titles could be "Eating fruit and vegetables accelerates cancer". Which is frankly not true. It requires the BACH1 protein to be present in tumor cells. The claim more simplified would be something like excess antioxidants help protect cells and thus grow. Also reasoning as to why you don't take high-dose antioxidants when going through treatment. Because it can interfere through protective mechanisms…

It's astonishing how BAD basically all media reporting around science is. Anytime I see a headline about science I assume it's bullshit and investigation within to the actual science behind it, it basically always is.

Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#49
post #7

> Common antioxidants, such as vitamins A, C, selenium, and zinc, can stimulate the growth of blood vessels in cancer when taken in excess. Is this to say that once you have cancer, these are bad, or that they promote the possibility of getting cancer. The second part is because we are continuously getting cancerous cells, but for the most part our immune system can deal with them before they become a problem.

The paper says nothing about promoting the possibility of getting cancer. Only after the cancer is advanced enough that the cancerous cells have formed a tumor, according to this study the antioxidants promote the growth of the blood vessels of the tumor, which is very undesirable, because the better vascularized a tumor is, the faster it grows. When there is no cancer, promoting the growth of the blood vessels is a…

Are antioxidants just helping all growth across the board, including tumors? Or do they help tumors more than other tissue?

I guess there’s a chance it might be an unfortunate or misleading message here if supplements reduce the risk of getting cancer more than they increase the severity once someone has it?

Re: Taking dietary supplements full of antioxidants could help cancerous tumors grow

#50

Other clickbait titles could be "Eating fruit and vegetables accelerates cancer". Which is frankly not true. It requires the BACH1 protein to be present in tumor cells. The claim more simplified would be something like excess antioxidants help protect cells and thus grow. Also reasoning as to why you don't take high-dose antioxidants when going through treatment. Because it can interfere through protective mechanisms…

It's astonishing how BAD basically all media reporting around science is. Anytime I see a headline about science I assume it's bullshit and investigation within to the actual science behind it, it basically always is.

If only everyone could be as good a writer as Derek Lowe or Ed Yong.
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