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When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

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Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#161

Post by borroka »

madeofpalk wrote: post #138
borroka wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is the HR-motivated eternal infantilization of the people. In fact, to the person who went through mental and physical developments with no blockages or traumas, it comes across as a quite paternalistic way of communicating, but it is a style liked and embraced by corporate coaches, HR, and the informal CYA policies.

I don’t think it has to be that deep. The world is a big place, full of many cultures that operate - especially with giving criticism - very differently. You don’t need to master the tone of every culture, but it’s important to at least be cognisant that even these difference exist.

I don't see my comment as particularly profound.

I have lived for a few decades at this point and have noticed, like anyone else I imagine, a desire in (some, but a nontrivial percentage of) people to maintain lifelong ways of thinking and behaving that have been historically associated with early life.

For example, a desire to be praised and not challenged, to dress like a teenager even as one nears retirement, to show a degree of enthusiasm for pedestrian events that was once reserved for major accomplishments.

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#162

Post by jahsome »

eweise wrote: post #157
ori_b wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you are calling out your colleagues for doing bad work, or not the way you would do it work, you should try to rephrase into praise w/ direction. “I really liked how you tackled this, have you thought about this approach?” Instead of “Why didn’t you do it this way?” I don't want to work with people that communicate this way.

I do. Having worked with so many engineers with almost no social skills, I think there's a lot of room for improvement in their communication style. "Why didn't you do it this way?" is aggressive and critical. "have you thought about this approach?" makes them feel like you have their back and are trying to help. I agree there's not a huge need to the "I really liked how you tackled this" part but even never praising…

I personally prefer earnest over disingenuous. There are fewer opportunities to misunderstand.

A question by it's nature isn't aggressive. The words "should" and "we" are the real cancers IMO, as in "we should have done..."

I think your example of have you thought about, vs. Why did you is potentially better but I personally don't have an issue answering either question or feel attacked in either case.

I would on the other hand be concerned about working with someone immature enough to read in so far to perfectly innocuous curiosity.

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#163

Post by tharkun__ »

eweise wrote: post #157
ori_b wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you are calling out your colleagues for doing bad work, or not the way you would do it work, you should try to rephrase into praise w/ direction. “I really liked how you tackled this, have you thought about this approach?” Instead of “Why didn’t you do it this way?” I don't want to work with people that communicate this way.

I do. Having worked with so many engineers with almost no social skills, I think there's a lot of room for improvement in their communication style. "Why didn't you do it this way?" is aggressive and critical. "have you thought about this approach?" makes them feel like you have their back and are trying to help. I agree there's not a huge need to the "I really liked how you tackled this" part but even never praising…

That's different though. I don't think your parent meant the "have you tried this approach" part but the very very fake and passive aggressive praise that then is turned into "actually I don't think you did great, please try this other approach". That's so fake and irritating.

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#166

Post by Zetice »

sethammons wrote: post #72
johndhi wrote: post #57

I disagree with the "ask first" suggestion. That's adding friction to the process that makes it less organic and will disincentivize actually doing it. Instead I will give feedback that I know won't hurt the employee I'm praising. There is an art to writing this stuff - usually making it more about yourself and how your problems are easier.

I let managers know about great interactions with their direct reports. It never occurred to me to ask. I may start doing so. But this reason for not doing it boils my blood: > One person mentioned that they got reprimanded by their manager for getting a spot peer bonus for helping someone on another team. This is a hill I will die on: people at $this_company are a team and helping one another is critical in building…

Same, and if you have a manager like that, just recognize that they're not going to be able to do much about it if you do help others. Just kind of ignore them if they suggest doing otherwise.

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#167

Post by mulmen »

Asking is CRITICAL. Do not praise me without consent. I have had too many abusive managers in my career to ever desire unsolicited praise. All information is a weapon in the hands of an abuser.

I may have helped you complete your task but my manager could interpret that as wasting time not delivering my own task.

In other words going over someone’s head (direct to their manager) is an aggressive and rude action. It is never kind or helpful, regardless of intent.

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#168

Post by nemetroid »

johnnyanmac wrote: post #98
whatshisface wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I think..." is a hedge, "I really liked," (when you didn't) is a lie.

But what if you did? No one is saying to lie. If you genuinely cannot find any good out of the code review (considerations for performance, easy to read, functional solution, time to execute, ability to reach out to proper peers), then maybe they shouldn't have been hired to begin with? Even a well picked intern these days should have one of those qualities.

It's right there in the description of the situation. You didn't like it: "If you are calling out your colleagues for doing bad work, ...".

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#169

Post by [deleted] »

edgarvaldes wrote: post #112
anon84873628 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying you don't want to work with the people who use praise w/ direction? That is my assumption about what you meant given that it seems like the contrary opinion and thus the reason for replying. If that's the case, care to elaborate why you don't like that style?

>I really liked how you tackled this Because you open the communication with a lie.

[deleted]

Re: When your coworker does great work, tell their manager (2020)

#170

Post by groby_b »

gabereiser wrote: post #38
groby_b wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you struggle with "I really liked" because you really didn't, I'd suggest the value-neutral "That's an interesting approach!" followed by "have you thought about X"/"how does it compare to "/"how did you land on it". You're still starting from a positive point of view for the recipient, which makes them more open to actually engaging with you. Without having to "pretend to smile and praise". It's an interesting ch…

Would you praise someone by saying “That’s an interesting approach?” Or is that just a comment on their outcome?

I'm not going to praise an outcome that's clearly suboptimal, but "that's interesting" still beats beating them over the head with "well, I'm always scrupulously honest, I don't care about anybody's feelings, your stuff sucks".

There's always effort-based praise if you want to praise.

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