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Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

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Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#181

Post by nkrisc »

exabrial wrote: post #88

Yes, absolutely, but there are pitfalls: * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay * Consumers despite "Least common denominator" which is often the result of "design by committee". Usually consumers are after something niche, unique, artistic, and creative, which is the inspiration…

> Consumers despite "Least common denominator" which is often the result of "design by committee". Usually consumers are after something niche, unique, artistic, and creative, which is the inspiration or vision of an individual.

The committee can decide to delegate tasks and decisions to individuals and set roles and responsibilities for individuals as well.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#182

Post by [deleted] »

expazl wrote: post #175
exabrial wrote: post #88

Yes, absolutely, but there are pitfalls: * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay * Consumers despite "Least common denominator" which is often the result of "design by committee". Usually consumers are after something niche, unique, artistic, and creative, which is the inspiration…

> Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay There are restaurants that charge north of 800$ per person which are always fully booked half a year in advance with glowing reviews even from the worst critics hellbent on being negative. You certainly can pay workers $250 an hour without raising prices above what customers are willing to pay depending on the product.…

[deleted]

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#183

Post by TulliusCicero »

expazl wrote: post #175
exabrial wrote: post #88

Yes, absolutely, but there are pitfalls: * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay * Consumers despite "Least common denominator" which is often the result of "design by committee". Usually consumers are after something niche, unique, artistic, and creative, which is the inspiration…

> Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay There are restaurants that charge north of 800$ per person which are always fully booked half a year in advance with glowing reviews even from the worst critics hellbent on being negative. You certainly can pay workers $250 an hour without raising prices above what customers are willing to pay depending on the product.…

Restaurants charging $800 per person are an extreme outlier. It's like talking about the car market in terms of Bentleys and McLarens.

99.9% of restaurants cannot charge super high prices, you're just being pedantic.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#184

Post by hot_gril »

exabrial wrote: post #88

Yes, absolutely, but there are pitfalls: * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay * Consumers despite "Least common denominator" which is often the result of "design by committee". Usually consumers are after something niche, unique, artistic, and creative, which is the inspiration…

Here's the reduced-down version: You get some stake for free when you join, it entitles you to a fraction of the profits while you're there, and you lose it if you quit or get voted off the island according to some bylaws. Stake also gives you voting power for hiring new employees (including managers), and how much stake to give them. And nobody can buy shares, especially those who aren't employees. To simplify things, there are no wages.

But idk, this just sounds like a worse version of a regular corporation. New employees' stakes will pay out in a way that's competitive with local wages. More profits than usual will have to be paid out rather than reinvested in the business (think high dividend yield, low P/E), otherwise new employees just needing to pay bills won't trust it. If they want to offer some wage and less stake, it's the same.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#185

Post by tashoecraft »

expazl wrote: post #175
exabrial wrote: post #88

Yes, absolutely, but there are pitfalls: * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay * Consumers despite "Least common denominator" which is often the result of "design by committee". Usually consumers are after something niche, unique, artistic, and creative, which is the inspiration…

> Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay There are restaurants that charge north of 800$ per person which are always fully booked half a year in advance with glowing reviews even from the worst critics hellbent on being negative. You certainly can pay workers $250 an hour without raising prices above what customers are willing to pay depending on the product.…

I’m going to call bs on that. I’ve dined at high end restaurants and there is no way you can pay people that much and survive. The problem is everything cost more. It’s not like it’s a $20 meal that’s 800.

There’s expensive plates, bowls, silver wear, custom presentation items. High end materials every where. You’re hiring more staff so that you can pay attention to every detail. The wine cellar might have several million dollars worth of wine in it.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#186

Post by delfinom »

ROTMetro wrote: post #163
carabiner wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is "reasonable," what is "fair." These words signify a death spiral in wage discussions. The reality is that businesses cannot increase prices forever and have a market that still wants to pay them. If I sell burgers for $10k and they're shit burgers then I'd make no money and have to shut it all down. Just like my friend who shut down his cabinetry business because he was paying his employees more than himself…

What you are referring to is a zombie business. It does not offer enough value so it can only survive via low wages, something that is not guaranteed and is externally controlled. I think banks should does including this measure when it comes to financing. If have to pay your people below market wages to survive you don't have a business, you have a zombie that can't only survive as a parasite on others. Figure out h…

It's fine, most banks don't directly finance small businesses lmao. They make you take out personal loans instead.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#187

Post by TulliusCicero »

e1g wrote: post #153

“Approval of any proposal or purchase has to be unanimous. Either the proposal is revised to be agreeable to everyone or it’s scrapped.” RIP.

This probably works fine at a small scale. With a small number of employees, you can cajole people into voting for something they're not 100% on board with, with the understanding that they'll get something they particularly want later on. There can be give and take.

But if you had a large, 1000+ person company, unanimity would obviously never work. You would have to go by majorities or supermajorities instead.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#188

Post by dgb23 »

dnissley wrote: post #108
p1necone wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay If it was worker owned wouldn't you just pay everyone some reasonable wage that the business can afford and then also split profits evenly?

Don't forget to split the losses evenly as well!

You are joking, but that's not untypical for worker owned businesses.

There are studies about coops that show that workers are more engaged in the business and will decide to suffer temporary wage cuts in hard times (opposed to layoffs) in order to maintain the business long term.

Two friends of mine actually have worked in the same restaurant coop at different times. The pay was fair, the conditions were good, the people were great and they had a high degree of agency. As you can imagine, they had high standards in terms of where they buy, what they produce and so on. Preferably local, fair etc. It's also a restaurant that exists since a long time.

The negatives that both reported were:

- Long meetings each month, there was no hierarchical structure. When the better argument wins (and not from who it is) then you need time to discuss things.

- Criticizing or firing people is emotionally taxing.

There was _never_ a complaint of shared responsibility in financial terms. That's a given. That's what you sign up for.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#189

Post by p1necone »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #113
p1necone wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay If it was worker owned wouldn't you just pay everyone some reasonable wage that the business can afford and then also split profits evenly?

Yes, but only if there is enough money to pay the base wage in the first place, which is far from a foregone conclusion. Let alone having any profit left to distribute.

Sure, but that's not a problem unique to worker owned businesses, any business without enough revenue to pay its bills is going to fall over.

Re: Can a worker-owned restaurant work?

#190

Post by KptMarchewa »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #183
expazl wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay There are restaurants that charge north of 800$ per person which are always fully booked half a year in advance with glowing reviews even from the worst critics hellbent on being negative. You certainly can pay workers $250 an hour without raising prices above what customers are willing to pay depending on the product.…

Restaurants charging $800 per person are an extreme outlier. It's like talking about the car market in terms of Bentleys and McLarens. 99.9% of restaurants cannot charge super high prices, you're just being pedantic.

Even more than Bentleys. There are three Michelin star restaurants that cost fraction of that.
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