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Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

theguardian.com

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Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#81

Post by Pannoniae »

apsurd wrote: post #31
thombles wrote: post #22

Stolen Focus is an interesting book and worth your time, but it's absolutely set on making the case that governments need to intervene on social media and I don't think it did it very well. I wrote a longish review digging into why back in June but it will probably only make complete sense if you've read the book. https://thomask.sdf.org/blog/2023/06/08/book-review-stolen-f...

Same with this article it seems. It's thought provoking. Worth the read. But the conclusion is rather underwhelming: it's an environment & societal problem. Also Big-Co is evil. That's not wrong per-say, but gee-whiz looks like we gotta add it to the growing list of how everything's terrible. The message is good just missed an opportunity to carry over the energy into action. I'll try: since we can't change society s…

But that is the entire point - you alone can't do much about this. It's not an underwhelming conclusion, there is nothing else to say, really. The way to solve this is societal change, not tweaking around the edges with your behaviour.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#82

Post by don-code »

I developed a pathological need to monitor Slack at all hours. It was largely based on the culture at my company (a startup, at the time) - while there was no written rule to install Slack on your phone, responding to Slack messages at 10pm was clearly a way to get ahead at the company.

I switched jobs and continued to run Slack on my phone, as everybody seems to do.

Some time in 2021, I got a new phone and just... didn't reinstall Slack. The world didn't end. I found myself just as much on top of things as I was, in spite of the fact that I was now making intentional visits to my laptop off hours (I didn't quit it entirely).

You're probably expecting me to say that this was rainbows and unicorns from there on out, but the exact opposite is true. Two years later, I'm still finding myself anxious much of the time, that I'm missing an important Slack message - sometimes at 10pm, sometimes at 6am. Sometimes I have, indeed, missed an important Slack message. Not having the capability to be notified instantaneously isn't a panacea. I'm only finding it better than the alternative.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#83

Post by [deleted] »

WalterBright wrote: post #48
Aurornis wrote: post #23

All of these supposed revelations that companies try to make products that people will use were supposed to empower people to break free from these addictions Yet anecdotally, these narrative seem to give people more excuses to engage further with their addictions of choice. I’ve heard so many variations of “It’s not my fault I use so much (Facebook|TikTok|Reddit), don’t you know they have people employed to make the…

In our modern society, everyone is a victim and it's always someone else's fault. My opinion that people in America do have choices and their lives are the sum of those choices inevitably elicits a lot of rather angry responses. All the people I've gotten to know over the years are all where they are as a result of their choices. The interesting thing about deciding to own your choices is it's empowering - you can ch…

[deleted]

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#84

Post by ipaddr »

thenerdhead wrote: post #77

I really enjoyed Stolen Focus. But that's because I wrote a similar book the same year. Some of the most thought-provoking resources on this topic in my opinion are: - Amusing Ourselves to Death - Four Arguments for the Elimination of Television - The Century of the Self - The Shallows - The Attention Merchants - Much of William James philosophy If anyone wants a copy of my book "Enough. Seeking less in a world of mo…

I would but I'm trying to cutdown on attention stealing devices.

It's ironic that you are trying to steal focus in order to tell others about how their focus has been stolen.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#85

Post by ipaddr »

cptroot wrote: post #45
apsurd wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with this article it seems. It's thought provoking. Worth the read. But the conclusion is rather underwhelming: it's an environment & societal problem. Also Big-Co is evil. That's not wrong per-say, but gee-whiz looks like we gotta add it to the growing list of how everything's terrible. The message is good just missed an opportunity to carry over the energy into action. I'll try: since we can't change society s…

One point that the article did land for me was the potential for individual change to be unhelpful. No-phone dinners only work if there isn't any sense of anxiety about not having your phone at dinner. That anxiety only goes away if you have an environment that allows you to unplug. Systemic changes like requiring workplaces to allow employees to have "off times" seem necessary to remove some of the baseline anxietie…

When you don't pickup people stop expecting you to. Set your own expectations.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#86

Post by fasterik »

Reminder that Johann Hari has been guilty in the past of plagiarism, fabricating stories, and maliciously editing the Wikipedia pages of his critics.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Hari

Stolen Focus, like his other works, has been criticized for failing to cite evidence for some of its claims and for misrepresenting scientific studies.

That doesn't mean he doesn't have valid points about the attention economy, but I think we should have a healthy skepticism.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#87

Post by xboxnolifes »

Pannoniae wrote: post #81
apsurd wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with this article it seems. It's thought provoking. Worth the read. But the conclusion is rather underwhelming: it's an environment & societal problem. Also Big-Co is evil. That's not wrong per-say, but gee-whiz looks like we gotta add it to the growing list of how everything's terrible. The message is good just missed an opportunity to carry over the energy into action. I'll try: since we can't change society s…

But that is the entire point - you alone can't do much about this. It's not an underwhelming conclusion, there is nothing else to say, really. The way to solve this is societal change, not tweaking around the edges with your behaviour.

> The way to solve this is societal change, not tweaking around the edges with your behaviour.

A single person can't change a society, but a single person can talk to 1-2 dozen people and maybe get 1-2 more people to talk to 1-2 dozen more.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#88

Post by romusha »

fasterik wrote: post #86

Reminder that Johann Hari has been guilty in the past of plagiarism, fabricating stories, and maliciously editing the Wikipedia pages of his critics. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Hari Stolen Focus, like his other works, has been criticized for failing to cite evidence for some of its claims and for misrepresenting scientific studies. That doesn't mean he doesn't have valid points about the attention economy,…

Thank you

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#89

Post by atleastoptimal »

don-code wrote: post #82

I developed a pathological need to monitor Slack at all hours. It was largely based on the culture at my company (a startup, at the time) - while there was no written rule to install Slack on your phone, responding to Slack messages at 10pm was clearly a way to get ahead at the company. I switched jobs and continued to run Slack on my phone, as everybody seems to do. Some time in 2021, I got a new phone and just... d…

There's something that never sits right with me with the constant status-anxiety go above and beyond, nothing is ever enough hustle/schmooze culture. Part of me thinks "hmm well that's how the most successful/high status people in society do it/favor so it must be the way things ought to be", but who knows. To me, it seems to maximize for the appearance of competence and relative importance, and thus favors political/aggressively social types over anyone with a reasonable desire for work life balance, and not just because they have the audacity to demand time to themselves, but giving your body/mind time to rest improves the quality of your work.

Re: Attention didn’t collapse. It was stolen (2022)

#90

Post by thenerdhead »

ipaddr wrote: post #84
thenerdhead wrote: post #77

I really enjoyed Stolen Focus. But that's because I wrote a similar book the same year. Some of the most thought-provoking resources on this topic in my opinion are: - Amusing Ourselves to Death - Four Arguments for the Elimination of Television - The Century of the Self - The Shallows - The Attention Merchants - Much of William James philosophy If anyone wants a copy of my book "Enough. Seeking less in a world of mo…

I would but I'm trying to cutdown on attention stealing devices. It's ironic that you are trying to steal focus in order to tell others about how their focus has been stolen.

No different than this guardian article stealing focus to do the same with a book launch!
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