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AI isn’t good enough

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191–200 of 374 posts

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#191
post #39
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you using GPT-4? If not, it's understandable. If you don't pay for ChatGPT, you get GPT-3.5. You can also get access to GPT-4 if you use the playground.

Why is it always the same reply? Yes, GPT4 is as useless as GPT3.5 on any non trivial task.

>Why is it always the same reply?

I keep going around telling people that 1+1=3, why do they always give me the same nonsense about the number '2'?

I blame Sam Altman.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see them more as creative artists who have very good intuition, but are poor logicians. Their world model is not a strict database of consistent facts, it is more like a set of various beliefs, and of course those can be highly contradictory.

That maybe sufficient for advertising, marketing, some shallow story telling etc., it is way too dangerous for anything in the physical sciences, legal, medicine, ...

On their own, yes. But if you have an application where you can check the correctness of what they come up with, you are golden. Which is often the case in the hard sciences.

It's almost like we need our AI's to have two brain parts. A fast one, for intuition, and a slow one, for correctness. ;-)

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Geoffrey Hinton, Andrew Ng, and quite a few other top AI researchers believe that current LLMs (and incoming waves of multimodal LFMs) learn world models; they are not simply 'stochastic parrots'. If one feeds GPT-4 a novel problem that does not require multi-step reasoning or very high precision to solve, it can often solve it.

A typical parrot repeats after you said something. A parrot that could predict your words before you said them, and could impersonate you in a phone call, would be quite scary (calling Hollywood, sounds like an interesting move idea). A parrot that could listen to you talking for hours, and then provide you a short summary, would probably also be called intelligent.

Our parrot does not simply repeat - he associates sounds and intent with what we doing.

At night when he is awake (he sleeps in our room in a covered cage) he knows not to vocalize anything more "Dear" when my wife gets up - he says nothing when I do this as he is not bonded to me.

When I sit at my computer and put on my headset he switches to using English words and starts having his own Teams meetings.

When the garage door opens or we walk out he the back door he starts saying Goodbye - Seeya later and then does the sound of the creaky outside gate.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are ignoring the fact that a toddler, once their musculature develops, is able to learn to walk after several tries. Show me a humanoid robot that can do that.

Not sure about humanoids but there are RL algorithms that can learn to walk from scratch in a quadruped in minutes.

Well that now is a proper technical revolution. The rest seems to mostly justify swallowing 9-digit numbers from investors from where I am standing, without the beneficiaries being able to show much for it.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That maybe sufficient for advertising, marketing, some shallow story telling etc., it is way too dangerous for anything in the physical sciences, legal, medicine, ...

On their own, yes. But if you have an application where you can check the correctness of what they come up with, you are golden. Which is often the case in the hard sciences. It's almost like we need our AI's to have two brain parts. A fast one, for intuition, and a slow one, for correctness. ;-)

Unclear to me. The economics might not be so great as you might need (i) expensive people, (ii) there could be a lot to check for correctness, and (iii) checking could involve expensive things beyond people. Net productivity might not go up much then.

For some industries where I understand the cost stacks with lower and higher skilled workers, I'd say it only takes out the "cheap" part and thereby not taking out a large chunk of costs (more like 10% cost out prior to paying for the AI). That is still a lot of cost reduction, but something that also will potentially be relatively quickly be "arbitraged away", i.e., will bleed into lower prices.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Geoffrey Hinton, Andrew Ng, and quite a few other top AI researchers believe that current LLMs (and incoming waves of multimodal LFMs) learn world models; they are not simply 'stochastic parrots'. If one feeds GPT-4 a novel problem that does not require multi-step reasoning or very high precision to solve, it can often solve it.

Anyone who has worked a bit with a top LLM thinks that they learn world models. Otherwise, what they are doing would be impossible. I've used them for things that are definitely not on the web, because they are brand new research. They are definitely able to apply what they've learnt in novel ways.

This statement on "learning world models" lies between overhyping, nitpicking and wishful thinking. There are many different ways we represent world knowledge, and llms are great in problems that relate with some of them, and horrible at others. For example, they are really bad with anything that has to do with spatial relations, and with logical problems where a graphical approach helps. There are problems that grade school children can easily solve with a graphical schema and the most advanced LLMs struggle with.

You can very easily give "evidence" of gpt4 being anywhere between emerging super-intelligence and a naked emperor depending what you ask it to solve. They do not learn models of the world, they learn models of some class of our models of the world, which are very specific and already very restricted in how they represent the world.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#197
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it always the same reply? Yes, GPT4 is as useless as GPT3.5 on any non trivial task.

My guess is people feel the need to self-justify their $20/month subscription.

My guess is most people into AI don't even remember that they are paying a $20/month for this.

We do a lot of experiments involving gpt3.5, 4, claude-v2, titan-large, and palm2, and for what it's worth, on our real production workloads gpt4 shines. We can make Palm2 produce decent results with a lot of extra effort, and claude-v2 is passable but gpt4 does not disappoint. This is low-grade knowledge management stuff, and we are not using it as a information-retrieval system - but for basic 'cognitive' tasks where all the information needed is provided in the prompt. I'd not rely on it for info retrieval tasks such as the examples quoted above - its knowledge base is highly compressed, after all.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#198
post #184
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> LLMs won't get intelligent. That's a fact based on their MO. They are sequence completion engines. A system that could perfectly predict what I would do in response to any particular stimuli, as a continuing sequence, would be exactly as intelligent as me. > They can be fine tuned to specific tasks, but at their core, they remain stochastic parrot Othello GPT was an attempt at answering this exact question, it's a…

A system that could perfectly predict what I would do in response to any particular stimuli, as a continuing sequence, would be exactly as intelligent as me. That's certainly interesting but it's not a depiction of a LLM is it ? LLM's are not deterministic, and (perhaps) so are we so two non-deterministic systems can only occasionally align (or so I assume). Intuition says they may get "close enough", whatever that m…

LLMs are deterministic if the temperature parameter is set to 0. Randomness is artificially injected into their outputs otherwise in order to make them more interesting, but they're just a series of math operations.

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#199
post #117
post #18

This entire piece is based on one massive, unsupported assertion, which is that LLM progress will cease. Or, as the author puts it, "we are at the tail end of the first wave of large language model-based AI... [it] ends somewhere in the next year or two with the kinds of limits people are running up against." I want to know only one thing, which is what gives him the confidence necessary to say that. If that one stat…

There has actually been research that found that there are strong diminishing returns in terms of at least expanding parameter sizes. While I think there are still breakthroughs to be made in terms of window sizes and workarounds like Mixture of Experts, I'm not sure how much farther we will get here in the long term in terms of raw performance of the LLM itself. FWIW, Sam Altman agrees and has a surprisingly similar…

GPT-4 is already based on a MOE approach. Just noting as this was placed in the "breakthroughs to be made".

Re: AI isn’t good enough

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Live systems in nature seem to solve similar problems with way less compute available Do they really? They're certainly more energy-efficient in business-as-usual mode, but a human brain has 86 billion neurons, 600+ trillion synapses(!), and each instance takes 15-20+ years to train to do complex logical tasks. Even if the per-cell work is tiny (and, is it? cells are amazingly complex), 86 billion (or 600+ trillion)…

You are ignoring the fact that a toddler, once their musculature develops, is able to learn to walk after several tries. Show me a humanoid robot that can do that.

You're missing all of the subskills that are developed along the way. They don't just grow, braindead, and twitch a couple times until they get the hang of walking.

Its a joy to watch a child grow up, but also its super interesting watching them figure out the most basic shit. Would highly recommend if you get the opportunity.

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