Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

rijksoverheid.nl

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

611–620 of 802 posts

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#611

Post by willcipriano »

HPsquared wrote: post #305
f1yght wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cars still kill people at high speed, human bodies haven't adapted to get hit by cars better.

The cars have adapted to hit people better though, at least for a given size of car. See Euro NCAP pedestrian test. Cars have softer front ends, and they even pop up on impact to give a softer landing for the pedestrian. Also, automatic emergency braking systems.

Automatic brakes, driver warning systems, better medicine to treat you if you do get hit. Less alcoholism and drunk driving. Radial tires, led headlamps, automatic windshield wipers, daytime running lights, ABS, airbags, hell I think a lot of cars didn't even have seatbelts standard back when some of these were set.

Can't even get 5 more mph on the highway.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#612

Post by mrguyorama »

lettergram wrote: post #151
bluescrn wrote: post #5

Give it a decade or two of inflation, and that's cash effectively outlawed

Then they can monitor all transactions and turn off purchases based on what they want the population to buy. Too much meat for a week, sorry can’t buy more until next week. “But I worked for this money” too bad. It’s effectively “the company store”, except government (“by the people and for the people” - ie your neighbors) dictating what you buy. They just happen to also invest in the companies they direct you to.

>It’s effectively “the company store”, except government (“by the people and for the people” - ie your neighbors) dictating what you buy.

You act like there isn't a MASSIVE distinction between a private business's CEO deciding what his employees should be able to do and an entire society democratically choosing what they want to be allowed.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#613

Post by tomrod »

thiht wrote: post #531
tomrod wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Paying something $10,000 cash strongly suggests you’re buying something illegal, or you got this money illegally (not necessarily unethically, but still illegally). Since when? Maybe I just want to buy a handsome dog that won a show?

What does it have to do with cash? Ever heard of bank transfers? Spending $10,000 cash sounds ridiculously unsafe for both parties. > Since when? Drug deals, money laundering schemes, theft, ransoms, etc. I fail to see non illegal way to obtain $10,000 cash. And if you can get it legally, just do bank transfers instead

It's a very small universe to assume that only illegal activity is conducted with 10k in currency.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#614

Post by za3faran »

havblue wrote: post #370

I was a juror for a divorce trial recently where the wife had a salary job while the husband spent their entire lives presumably accepting checks for contract work and cashing them without a bank account. So that portion of their joint income was to avoid the IRS and it of course made the settlement difficult because he didn't have any receipts for any of his work that was entirely done under the table. The plus side…

People paying 30%-50% or more of their paychecks (not to mention VAT/sales tax) should stop and think about the enormous waste that goes on in their governments with respect to the money they're forced to give them.

Islam has a 2.5% Zakat contribution amount for money, yet Islamic countries were very prosperous until colonization started post WWI, which continues to this day. Even today the Gulf states do not have these exorbitant taxes and they're doing quite well in the face of the capitalistic international financial system, even though they're heavily bitten by it.

Give people the choice to pay 2.5% of their cash holdings and other wealth vs. 35%-50%+ of their income and it's easy to see what they'll choose. But it doesn't sit well with the greedy and wasteful governments, nor the law makers and lobbyists who design the laws with loopholes to be abused by certain people.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#615

Post by tomrod »

OfSanguineFire wrote: post #610
tomrod wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> That's a separate problem that allowing overeager regulation of currency utilization enables. > Now it seems like you are resorting to the libertarian fantasizing that used to be so common on news-for-nerds sites. As I see no reason it is a fantasy, I'll continue "resorting" to the reality that, frankly, the entity able to put me to death legally probably doesn't need to know my reasons and justifications for ever…

> the entity able to put me to death legally The country that is the subject of this HN post does not have the death penalty. > That's a weird way to spell "banks and financial institutions." ’Cause I wasn’t spelling that. Within welfare states, public will to minimize tax evasion is widespread. In Europe steps are already being taken to improve transaction processing and democratize this area of the banking industry…

And rates of tax evasion are high enough to justify further entrenchment and subsidization of banking institutions?

> The country that is the subject of this HN post does not have the death penalty.

Fine, lifetime imprisonment on trumped up charges. Please don't be disingenuous, coercion is coercion whether the loss of liberty is death or imprisonment.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#616

Post by atemerev »

jpsouth wrote: post #593
atemerev wrote: post #156

Here in Switzerland, I have a daily cash limit to put in ATM (there are ATMs allowing cash deposits), and this limit is about 50000 francs (52400 euros). Daily. Fully anonymous. There is no limit, of course, for in-person deposits (and withdrawals) at the bank counter. You can get millions in cash. And you can buy and sell gold bars anonymously. I love Switzerland. Not that I have that much money, but I love this kin…

I’m curious, aside from it going into a bank account (so it isn’t actually anonymous), my question is the mechanism of how the deposit works. In the UK we have deposit machines but you must put a card in the machine before depositing money (and my bank in particular make you input your PIN to make a deposit, so I just use the counter staff)

Ah, yes, you have to put a card and sometimes (not always) know a PIN, but nobody checks whether it is your card.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#617

Post by mrguyorama »

whelp_24 wrote: post #218
sgt101 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonsense - it stops criminals and tax evaders from doing the things that they do to undermine society.

I am 100% certain that you can evade taxes, and do crime without cash. Even movies have criminals do wire transfers. It is hard to have, say, negative interest rates though.

>Even movies have criminals do wire transfers.

And movies are famously accurate portrayals of things right?

It's extremely difficult to do lot's of profitable crime without cash. When the IRS sees large transactions routinely coming in, they're going to ask WTF you do for a living, and eventually want some evidence of that. Forensic accounting is VERY powerful.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#618

Post by nottorp »

systems_glitch wrote: post #530
Loughla wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I purchase, restore, and sometimes sell old woodworking machinery as a side gig to subsidize my own purchase of woodworking equipment for my shop. I have had multiple cash transactions above $3,000 every year that I've done this. Not to avoid taxes, not to keep them off the books, but because one of the parties has either the unwillingness or inability to take electronic payments. Elderly people, those located in rur…

A mechanic we used before moving had a strict no checks policy. He had a bad check for the repair of a church bus, from a church, framed in a fancy gold-painted frame, with "IN GOD WE TRUST, ALL OTHERS PAY CASH" below it.

But that's because you still use checks over there :)

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#619

Post by tomrod »

Scarblac wrote: post #594
tomrod wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Use of systems is never free. It might be subsidized, in the which case bankers would greatly appreciate more transactions on the system, but it is never "free."

It costs some money to have a bank account, bank transfers don't have a fee associated with them. Card processing costs a small fee. Cheaper than handling cash though.

And those rates are increased when the system becomes more expensive, whether directly to bank fees or indirectly by taxpayer subsidizing.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#620

Post by tomrod »

pasc1878 wrote: post #583
tomrod wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These purchases are already so bound up with red tape that making the actual payment via bank transfer is hardly an inconvenience. That's a separate problem that allowing overeager regulation of currency utilization enables. > Extortion is a crime. You are listing a person’s attempt to placate a criminal as a reason the state shouldn’t get involved? Correct, extortion is a crime in some locales. Note, I said hush m…

Tax payers benefit. There are not transactions that avoid paying cash - they are reported to the tax authorities - so tax payers pay less. Hush Money - these means something is being covered up - this would be better in the open - what ios the difference to balckmail.

Addressed in other comment a few hours ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37237018
Post reply on HN