Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands • Hacker News Board

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#441

Post by ldhough » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

rightbyte wrote: post #376

rascul wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I carry my cash in a pocket on my pants. It doesn't get ruined.

Maybe it is because I put my hands in my pocket all the time or something if I am the only one with this problem ..

Definitely not the only one, an entire country decided that durability is important for the $1 denomination, I'll copy what I posted above:

I was recently in El Salvador, which uses the USD as an official currency (alongside BTC lol). Despite using dollars, the $1 coins are used instead of notes almost exclusively for that denomination (mostly presidential dollars and some silver Susan B Anthony dollars). I was curious and did a bit of research, apparently the reason is that because day-to-day transactions are done almost entirely in small amounts of cash the paper notes have a very short lifespan (apparently <1yr) there, while coins will last decades.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#442

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

dr_win wrote: post #286

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is the Vexl Foundation and why should I care about their index or what they think? I could create any index I want, along with a slick website, to deride or elevate any cause that I want.

Creators of P2P bitcoin exchange: https://vexl.it The data is well sourced and the code is open-source. You don't have to trust or rely on their authority. Don't trust, verify!

So a bitcoin exchange created an index that makes themselves look good?

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#443

Post by ffhhttt » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

gunapologist99 wrote: post #429

input_sh wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if they find more than 3000 eur in one place that is not pre authorized, they will confiscate it all and punish the people who had that kind of cash; it's becoming 'the law' Can you please not make shit up to be obsessed about?

No need to curse to make your point, especially since this is a burgeoning area of both criminal and civil law in western countries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asset_forfeiture#European_Unio...

So you need to be convicted by a court and the government needs to be able prove the money was obtained from illegal sources?

How is that unreasonable and more importantly what does it have to do with the €3000 limit discussed in this thread?

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#444

Post by gunapologist99 » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

bryanlarsen wrote: post #356

HDMI_Cable wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think GP's intention was to mention the farmers themselves, who would (presumably, I'm neither a farmer nor European) receive above >€3000 in egg-revenue per week/month/annum, and then go deposit that at the bank, use it for mortgage payments, or pay for farm equipment et al. in cash.

AFAICT it doesn't outlaw depositing >€3000 at the bank, it'll just be reported. And that's what farmers are annoyed at. If they don't deposit it, they can "forget" to report the income themselves, and cheat the tax man.

This doesn't follow; then they could just spend it in increments of less than €3000.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#445

Post by gambiting » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

dealuromanet wrote: post #389

gambiting wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>also be removing the noise cameras installed along the roads when they remove the roads? Why would they be paying for upkeep of cameras that do absolutely nothing?

What do you mean they do nothing? They have a redundant microphone array that can track sound with high precision and a camera that can be used to automatically issue fines. Just point the hardware at the people walking about or congregating and see who is saying things The Cabinet doesn't like to hear. Or maybe even who isn't saying enough of what the Cabinet wants to hear. Why get rid of a perfectly functioning and…

You realize someone would actually need to repurpose them to do such things, operation which would cost money and technical know how, right? They don't come with those capabilities out of the box.

It's just such a weird argument that you're making. It's like saying that once roads disappear all the speed cameras are going to be repurposed to take pictures of you walking about to match facial data or something. Technically possible I suppose, but given how these things work it might as well be sci-fi. Government would have to scrap the entire system and buy new devices that do what you suggest, and that's where the whole idea will fail.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#446

Post by wing-_-nuts » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

panax wrote: post #308

throwawaysleep wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regular working people are spending 3K in cash?

After a few decades of inflation from now that will be a much more common occurrence and the laws will probably never be updated to reflect that.

Yep, an example of this was how people on SSI disability were restricted from not having more than 2k worth of assets in the 1980s, and it hasn't been updated since. Good luck escaping that poverty trap.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#447

Post by ElectricalUnion » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

macinjosh wrote: post #384

elric wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is targeted at law abiding smallholding farmers where roadside transactions are often done in cash Where (in NL) do you find farmers who routinely need to accept >3k in cash and are (somehow?) unable to accept electronic payments? Pretty much everyone everywhere can accept at least one form of electronic payments. That's a legal requirement for any business in Belgium, and I can't imagine the Dutch being that…

Why does the NL want to kick down at the farmers so badly? Don't they know where real food comes from?

Is the only way to buy "real food", to buy it in chunks of 3000+ EUR paper money?

That sounds pretty expensive and a lot of "real food" for the average person.

And if it is a business transaction sounds like a suspicious business transaction.

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#448

Post by Aaargh20318 » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

someplaceguy wrote: post #292

rantallion wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's the small matter of millions of undocumented migrants entering Europe who will be trapped in this now-illegal-cash underclass Are these migrants frequently making cash payments in excess of €3000?

If they want to pay rent or buy a car or any other thing of value, yes. Also, it doesn't matter whether it's frequent or not. "Let's ban migrants from buying cars because they don't buy them frequently" is not exactly the most convincing argument.

Who the hell pays rent in cash? I doubt that’s even an option with any rental company except for shady / illegal slumlords, who will ignore this law anyway.

Also, what kind of illegal immigrant rents a >€3000/month home?

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#449

Post by pif » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

motohagiography wrote: post #127

They can't control the black market in drugs, what makes them think controlling a black market in cash , which is a million times more desirable, will be any more successful? There's the small matter of millions of undocumented migrants entering Europe who will be trapped in this now-illegal-cash underclass, and these financial oppression laws just incentivise and create criminal networks to facilitate basic economy.…

[dead]

Re: Cash payments above €3000 to be outlawed in Netherlands

#450

Post by _visgean » Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

dmurray wrote: post #75

_visgean wrote: post #38

We had a guy in Usti nad labem coming to Raiffeisenbank every few weeks and deposing money, approximately 4b usd in total. The bank was supposed to run due diligence but its Raiffeisenbank which does not seem to give a shit. I can sort of understand trying to limit cash when you see that the due diligence is mostly omitted. https://www.irozhlas.cz/zpravy-domov/smenarny-prani-spinavyc...

4 billion dollars! Supposing he carried a large army rucksack each time, full with 25kg of US $100 bills. That would be 2.5 million dollars a time, and it would still take him 1600 trips. If he came "every few weeks" at 20 times a year, it would take him 80 years. A billion dollars really is a lot of money. Perhaps he brought the money by wheelbarrow or car or container truck, or he dealt exclusively in €500 notes, s…

he was mostly using euros per the article. Also the article mentions he mostly traveled by train... The article mentions he usually took the money back in dolars.