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“Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#51

Post by cellularmitosis »

reilly3000 wrote: post #49
OJFord wrote: post #45

Reminds me of 'fruit-only-diet influencer dead at 39'. However 'healthy' an extreme diet seems, in extreme it almost certainly isn't. Yes most people should probably eat more fruit; no they should not eat exclusively fruit. (random source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/01/zhanna-sam... )

RIP Steve Jobs. It was likely his Apple-only diet that did him in. He would go to these orchards in NorCal and disappear for weeks on end, eating only apples the whole time. He tried eating apples aggressively to cure his colon cancer and it appears to have exacerbated it.

The lesson from Jobs is not "don't eat too much fruit", it's "listen to your doctors when they tell you to treat your cancer".

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#52

Post by mvkel »

reilly3000 wrote: post #49
OJFord wrote: post #45

Reminds me of 'fruit-only-diet influencer dead at 39'. However 'healthy' an extreme diet seems, in extreme it almost certainly isn't. Yes most people should probably eat more fruit; no they should not eat exclusively fruit. (random source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/01/zhanna-sam... )

RIP Steve Jobs. It was likely his Apple-only diet that did him in. He would go to these orchards in NorCal and disappear for weeks on end, eating only apples the whole time. He tried eating apples aggressively to cure his colon cancer and it appears to have exacerbated it.

This is simply not true and reads like a convenient anecdote to make a point.

"Founder of Apple only eats... apples! Omg lol"

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#54

Post by scq »

chrisco255 wrote: post #50
atleastoptimal wrote: post #39

Oxalates can be balanced out with calcium, that's why cruciferous veggies don't cause as many issues as spinach.

No they can't, as this study shows. The problem is that calcium is bonding to the oxalates. Normally your body will pass them through excretion, but it appears that oxalates in high quantities should be avoided altogether, as they just seem to collect in the kidney. Skip the oxalates and just take the calcium. One is essential and the other is the opposite.

Agree about avoiding high quantities of oxalate, but the point of taking calcium is so that the binding occurs in the gut where it can be excreted, rather than the kidneys.

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#55

Post by cellularmitosis »

jzawodn wrote: post #14
hirundo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A constrained diet can be a useful tool in identifying which foods cause inflammation and other issues. I now live on a subset of the food groups based on a few dozen such N=1 cleanse experiments, with much improved health.

say more?

Elimination diets are also common among IBD sufferers to identify which foods are making symptoms worse during a flare-up.

Diet alone is never enough to get you out of the flare-up, but it makes a big difference in how deeply you suffer.

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#56

Post by nullc »

reilly3000 wrote: post #49
OJFord wrote: post #45

Reminds me of 'fruit-only-diet influencer dead at 39'. However 'healthy' an extreme diet seems, in extreme it almost certainly isn't. Yes most people should probably eat more fruit; no they should not eat exclusively fruit. (random source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/01/zhanna-sam... )

RIP Steve Jobs. It was likely his Apple-only diet that did him in. He would go to these orchards in NorCal and disappear for weeks on end, eating only apples the whole time. He tried eating apples aggressively to cure his colon cancer and it appears to have exacerbated it.

Jobs had an islet cell neuroendocrine tumor, a rare type of pancreatic cancer.

He decided to delay surgical treatment in favor of dietary treatment presumably because at the time there was little evidence for the effectiveness of surgical treatment (and obviously plenty of risk connected to it).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4924574/

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#57

Post by crazygringo »

mvkel wrote: post #52
reilly3000 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

RIP Steve Jobs. It was likely his Apple-only diet that did him in. He would go to these orchards in NorCal and disappear for weeks on end, eating only apples the whole time. He tried eating apples aggressively to cure his colon cancer and it appears to have exacerbated it.

This is simply not true and reads like a convenient anecdote to make a point. "Founder of Apple only eats... apples! Omg lol"

It's mostly true AFAIK, according to Walter Isaacson's biography.

I don't think he disappeared for weeks in orchards, but he would reportedly eat only apples for weeks at a time, or carrots. He was a "fruitarian" for a period of time. [1]

And he didn't eat only apples to cure his cancer, but he did choose things like "dietary supplements and juices" specifically to cure his cancer, instead of modern medical recommentations. Which he then regretted when the cancer progressed. [2]

It's not a random coincidence that he named the company Apple. He was really into apples, like more than anybody you've probably ever met.

[1] https://www.nbcnews.com/healthmain/strange-eating-habits-ste...

[2] https://www.forbes.com/sites/alicegwalton/2011/10/24/steve-j...

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#58

Post by Modified3019 »

stickfigure wrote: post #46
atarian wrote: post #4

This is why I tell people to go easy on the spinach when they’re making smoothies.

I offer, somewhat tongue-in-cheek, this lecture: Don't eat plants; they're trying to kill you! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1cqNDDG4aA I usually forward it to friends that rant about meat being bad for your health.

Depends on the meat. If it’s western raised pork or chicken, they bioaccumulate omega-6 from their feed that the percentage of their fat that’s omega-6 can rivals or exceed that of “vegetable” oils. Ruminants seem to resist this bioaccumulation.

So the wrong meat give you all the same lovely effects of systemic inflammation, paradoxical immune suppression, metabolism suppression, and the pile of strange effects from the metabolites and free radicals. Which normally don’t matter much, but start to do when modern consumption of omega-6’s end up significantly more than historical exposure, all year long.

This is one thing to watch out for in rodent studies involving “fat”. In addition to having a very different relationship to fat than humans, the fat they are given is generally very high in omega-6, often being lard (from western raised pigs) mixed with some amount of vegetable oil. Thus because “animal fat” was used, the generally negative outcome then gets wrongly associated with saturated fats. If the study doesn’t give a breakdown of the fatty acid profile, then it’s basically worthless. Unless someone feels like trying to track down the researchers and find the chow product they used. Which is sometimes viable.

Re: “Green smoothie cleanse” causing acute oxalate nephropathy

#60

Post by crazygringo »

Bluecobra wrote: post #12
zingababba wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, throwing a bunch of greens into a blender is not a great way to consume them. Boiling/steaming is the way to go. The vast majority of vegetables I personally eat are well cooked and mushy.

I used to make green smoothies all the time, even went as far to by an expensive Blentec blender. If you are following Weight Watchers you actually get penalized for blending/juicing vegetables, so I stopped. Normally these are zero point foods. Their justification makes a lot of sense to me: https://www.weightwatchers.com/au/blog/food/why-fruit-counts...

Man, I wish that chewing and food volume would reduce my hunger.

The only thing that makes me stop feeling hungry is my blood sugar going back up to a normal level.

I'm truly envious if there's actually anybody out there who can eat low-calorie bulky foods and actually feel satisfied by the meal. I just feel bloated but still just as hungry as before eating.

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